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On 1 PhotoRaw 2019

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lomitamike View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote lomitamike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: On 1 PhotoRaw 2019
    Posted: 02 December 2018 at 18:59
After 2 or 3 years of searching for a editor to replace apple aperture, it looks like this one On1PR19 is finally the one do do that for my needs.

I thought the fundamental layout of apple aperture was as intuitive as any raw editor as I have ever tried. I've looked at or tried many since aperture was killed off but none had the intuitiveness and just didn't feel right. I could never be completely satisfied the way I was when using aperture.

I don't know if PR19 will be the one I settle for, but from what I've seen it looks as though it was designed to be very intuitive with it's layout. I've seen demonstration videos and the workflow that was used in the demonstrations is close to exactly the workflow I used in aperture. Some of the tools have different names and there are a lot more possibilities then what you had with aperture, but it just looks right to me.

Are there any photographers still using aperture? I still use on occasion. When photo's just won't do it. But I made the switch to "photo's" January 1, 2018 to finally get away from aperture (although I still maintain a huge library in aperture) and buy time to find a replacement.

Any thoughts from current or ex-aperture users? what did you do?

Or any thoughts on On 1 PR 2019?

Appreciate any input.
Thanks.
 



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MartyMoose View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MartyMoose Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 December 2018 at 01:17
No experience with aperture but I've recently purchased On1 PR 2019 and experimenting with it yesterday and today.

I've not been photographing since late 2016 and just getting back into. To help get me started I've started experimenting with On1 and watching a few videos.

It seems to be more than enough for what I need a raw editor for as a hobbyist.

Going through some old raw files from ~2016...

1. Yellow Flowers in Summertime



2. Mountain Waterfall and Bridge



3. Snowy Winter Landscape in B&W



4. A Bridge in the Fall



Today is pretty much my 2nd day with On1 and it seems to have everything I need. Although I still have LR5, PS6, C1Pro 8 and C1 11 for Sony (free) if things don't work out with On1. But it seems fine and the price seems fair, too.
ILCE's a6000, a7, a7ii
CZ Batis 25, 85, SEL's 55/1.8, 35/1.4, 16-70/4, 24-70/4, 70-200/4, 90/2.8G Macro, 55-210/4.5-6.3, 16-50/3.5-5.6, Rokinon E 12/2
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AudioDoc View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote AudioDoc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 December 2018 at 05:10
I've been using On1 Photo Raw for a couple years now and On1 Perfect Photo Suite before that. Just updated from PR 2018 to 2019. I like the improvements with 2019, though so far it seems a little sluggish on my computer, compared to the previous version. Have to figure out why that is. Sorry, I've never used Aperture, so no idea how PR compares with that. All my previous experience is with Lightroom which I still use for some editing. On1 Photo Raw is a very powerful photo editor, and certainly all most of us would ever need. It has layers like PS and very good masking tools and filters. A tool I used extensively in the past was the quick mask, which PR doesn't have in all modules yet, but it is in the works. You've got to go with what works for your work flow. On1 has excellent training videos and webinars. It is a small company compared to Adobe, but it is really geared for the photographer and they listen to the feedback from their customers. BBTW, a few of the staff members are Sony users. I'm an On1 Plus member. This months guest trainer is Colby Brown.
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lomitamike View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote lomitamike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2018 at 00:57
Thanks for the reply's
Im happy to hear the positive feedback (except for the sluggishness).

Marty,
I have seen a few videos of how the PR19 workflow is designed to be used in a particular order the instructor was demonstrating. In does seem to be a smooth workflow and rather intuitive once you understand the capabilities of each tool.
I'm more of an enthusiast at this point of my photography. Hustling photography is no fun, I just want to enjoy it now. But I do want a toolbox that give me all the tools my minds eye needs.

Doc
My current mac just meets the requirements so I'm hesitating to download until I upgrade. Im almost certain that my mac would be sluggish. The free training video's are definitely enough to get me up and running. Very helpful.

I appreciate your reply's, is there a certain way you catalogue your photo's? In app? On your HD? External HD? How do you set up you folder system?

Aperture had an in app library that was great until they gave up on it. Now I have to start a new library and I'm listening to all photographers way of organizing their photo's. Don't want to have to do it twice, make that 3 times.
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oldguy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote oldguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2018 at 14:49
I've used Aperture and On 1, though haven't upgraded to On 1 2019 yet. I have it matched to Lightroom but with each successive iteration I use less and less of the Lightroom editing functions. The training videos are great and the program is intuitive, if not quite as intuitive as Aperture. Love it for b&w processing particularly.

Not quite as positive about cataloging and storing but that's because I think Lightroom is so good at it.
Bruce
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AudioDoc View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote AudioDoc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2018 at 15:28
Mike,

You are welcome. I have found what was causing the sluggishness. It is an issue most will not experience. I have a wide color gamut monitor and use the AMD Fire Pro V4900 video card. To take advantage of wide color gamut, you need to have a card that will run 10 bit pixel format, which the Fire Pro has. When I turned that off, the problem was gone. Turning it back on and functions were still quick. Don't why, but have presented this to On1 support team. They have always been very responsive. You likely don't use 10 bit pixel mode so its not likely you would have any issues like that. The program should normally be very quick, compared with Lightroom.

On1 Photo Raw has an excellent photo browser. It sees the folders as they exist on your drive. Its not a catalog system like Lightroom. I organize my folders by date, then name of event. I create a new folder each year and my photo shoots are then subfolders with date, place or event. You can tag your photos in the photo browser and apply keywords. Its much quicker than Lightroom. Again, I have no idea how Aperture worked. In the browser you can go directly to develop and editing photos with layers, (which Lightroom has never had). You have to go to Photoshop for that. I'm not really sure why the cataloging system of Lightroom is really necessary. I prefer to have control over where I put my photos. I don't see any advantage of the Lightroom system. It is also very slow in comparison with the On1 Browser. However there are some features in lightroom that are missing in On1, such as automatically applying copyright data when importing photos, and the print features so I till us Lightroom for some of those features. But, there is no time consuming import funtion in On1, which I prefer.

I have my operating system with application on an SSD and a large hard drive just for my photos and a separate drive for my other data. I use external drives for backing up. This is a desktop PC which I built myself running Windows 10 64 bit. I like Apple products and the OS, but I don't like the lack of flexibility and of course, the price. In recent years, it obvious that Apple is not very interested in the pro and prosumer market. They make their money with consumer products now. In my opinion, these larger companies like Apple, Adobe and Microsoft are a little too full of themselves and not always in touch with us, the photographers. This is what I really like about On1. They are photographers and very much in touch with their customers. Maybe a bit like Minolta was with their customers (Of course look where that got them).

Hope this was helpful.

Kind regards,

Kelly
 



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AudioDoc View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote AudioDoc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2018 at 16:03
Mike,

One additional point, Lightroom and Photoshop are now subscription based products. On1 is not. Though they do have a new upgrade product each year which you have to pay to upgrade, but you don't have to if the current product does what you need it to. Also, the browser shows all of your drives, including your cloud drives. So when I connect my camera or insert my SD card into my card reader, I can download my photos to the folder which I select (or create a new folder). I think you will find many photographers will prefer to put their photos in folders they create, rather than have software do it for them. Many pros will prefer to organize by the name of the event or shoot and if they are using a laptop, will use an external drive for storing their photos. When I travel, I take my iPad and a WD Wireless Pro, which has a built in SD card reader. I can then view my photos on my iPad via wifi.

if you have time, watch one of the videos on how the On1 browser works.

Kelly

Edited by AudioDoc - 13 December 2018 at 16:32
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MartyMoose View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MartyMoose Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2018 at 18:31
My early test results/observations using On1 PR '19 natively vs remotely.

On1 provides minimum and recommended system requirements here.

They also provide some video card configuration tips here.

re: On1 PR '19 sluggishness...

When running On1 PR '19 natively on my 'work' PC I find that some areas of the workflow are a bit sluggish; for instance, when working within layers and when exporting processed raw files.

'Work' PC specs:
Intel i5 4690k (3.5GHz)
32GB DDR3 RAM
nVidia GTX 970 video card
Windows 10 OS and application installed onto native Samsung 850 EVO SSD
Image files located on native SATA3 spinning HDDs

Today I've installed On1 PR '19 30-day trial onto a 'Remote' PC and remotely connected to it via VNC.

'Remote' PC Specs:
Intel i7 5930k (3.5GHz)
64GB DDR4 RAM
nVidia GTX 970 video card
Windows 10 OS and application installed onto native Samsung m.2 NVME SSD
Image files located on network attached storage device (NAS)

Early results in my scenario indicate significantly improved performance on the 'Remote' PC when exporting processed raw image files, even when the files being edited are located on a NAS and exported to the same NAS.

I've yet more testing to do with working within layers and with improving VNC's screen size and resolution, but at this early stage in my testing it seems to me that On1 PR '19's export function is improved with the CPU, RAM and SSD (the video card in the two PC's are identical).
ILCE's a6000, a7, a7ii
CZ Batis 25, 85, SEL's 55/1.8, 35/1.4, 16-70/4, 24-70/4, 70-200/4, 90/2.8G Macro, 55-210/4.5-6.3, 16-50/3.5-5.6, Rokinon E 12/2
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Post Options Post Options   Quote AudioDoc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2018 at 20:14
Thanks Steve,
I've seen all the min requirements and display card specs but didn't see anything about wide color gamut support and 10 bit pixel format support. All specs of my computer meet or exceed the min requirements. Is your nVidia card 10 bit pixel format?   I've had my card for about 4 years and its already considered a "legacy" product. Insane how quickly this stuff becomes obsolete. How good is nVidea at supporting their products with driver updates? The newest driver for my Fire Pro is at least 2 years old. My son works in the Motion Graphics/broadcast design field and prefers the nVideo pro graphics cards over AMD. Of course I'm not a pro and have to budget these things. As you know things get very expensive in the digital darkroom! Or course then there are the cameras and lenses. An expensive hobby!
Kelly
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MartyMoose View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MartyMoose Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 hours 28 minutes ago at 14:00
I don't think the GTX 970 supports 10-bit workflow. It seems more likely that the Quadro Pro line in the nVidia market probably supports this, but it's outside my scope as a hobbyist. For driver updates, yes, nVidia seems to provide updates fairly often.

ILCE's a6000, a7, a7ii
CZ Batis 25, 85, SEL's 55/1.8, 35/1.4, 16-70/4, 24-70/4, 70-200/4, 90/2.8G Macro, 55-210/4.5-6.3, 16-50/3.5-5.6, Rokinon E 12/2
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AudioDoc View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote AudioDoc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9 hours 23 minutes ago at 01:05
Thank you, Steve,

Well I had a reply within 24 hours from On1 support. They provided me with an update, however I was told that the program does not support 10 bit pixel format for wide gamut color! They have a suggestion page for On1 Plus members and I placed a request for it. They may add it as an update in a future version. I'd be interested in knowing if Lightroom, Photoshop and other editing software supports it.

Kelly
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Post Options Post Options   Quote lomitamike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 3 hours 33 minutes ago at 06:55
Again, Thanks for the very informative reply's, and from all senior members too.

Kelly, glad to hear you figured out the cause of your sluggishness. Hopefully On 1 will have a fix so your video card works in the near future.

In regards to starting a new photo library, chronological order is how prefer to do things. Year/Month/ event. Im just not sure how to import yet, or how On 1 PR19 will handle a library outside of the app. To be determined.

Steve, I've been reading about PC specs all day in regards to preparing to buy a new desktop workstation. My computer tech knowledge is nowhere near what your explaining in your test. But I do recognize the key points your talking about. I'm not quite clear on the "remote" PC and VNC. But I do understand the specs your using to describe the differences of the PCs. The biggest difference I see is the increased RAM and the SSD with the i7 remote PC. Which would definitely increase the import/export speeds.

Im considering getting an iMac with a 4.2GHz Intel i7, 1TB SSD, the smallest about of RAM 8GB, then buy aftermarket 64GB (much cheaper). I would connect an external 2TB SSD via thunderbolt 3 for my photo library.

I still have to figure out what to do with my current 800GB aperture library thats needs to be placed somewhere.

Im currently using an early 08 iMac.

3.06 GHz Intel core 2 duo
2 TB WD black Caviar HDD (upgrade)
6 GB 800 MHz DDR2 SDRAM (maximum)
NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GS 512 MB
I've opened up this mac 3 times for upgrades ( 2 upgraded HDDs and power supply). Unfortunatly Apple won't allow for any further OS upgrades with this processor.

So it looks like it's time to invest in something new. It's been a long time.

The rumors are the iMacs will be updated early next year with the next generation "sunny cove" processors and a new intel graphics processor. There are supposed to be some significant performance gains, if I can wait.

Working photo's, building and maintaining an organized library requires some careful planning when considering a new workstation. Im figuring out that there are some nice benefits to using external storage.

I do appreciate all the information shared here, its very helpful.

I also feel very optimistic about On 1 PR19. I may download it tomorrow and give it a try. Hopefully my old mac can handle it.

You guys make Dyxum an awesome place for us photographers.

Thanks again

Mike.
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