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a99II Multiple Exposure ?

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Roger Rex View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Roger Rex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: a99II Multiple Exposure ?
    Posted: 18 June 2017 at 22:05
A common characteristic, apparently (because I have seen it demonstrated in several models), of high end canikons is the ability to take, in-camera, multiple exposures. I have seen this in action with a small Fuji as well. Typically, the menus in these cameras call this "image overlay" which allows you to take two or more images while placing them on top of each other and letting you see the result. In the past I did multiples on the computer in Photoshop by stacking the layers, etc. - a cumbersome process. I have searched in the the Sony a99II menus and through the Friedman pdf but cannot find this capability. Does anyone know if this capability exists and, if so, where can I find it in the menus, etc.? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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sybersitizen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2017 at 22:31
That capability does not exist in any A-mount camera. It might exist in some other Sony cameras, or in some smartphone apps for other Sony cameras; but A-mount cameras don't support such apps either.
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sybersitizen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2017 at 22:37
Yep, here it is ... but not for A-mount.
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Roger Rex View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Roger Rex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2017 at 22:50
sybersitizen - Thanks, have seen that. Not sure why Sony would not include this feature, especially when many competitor's cameras include it. Not the first time that I don't understand where Sony is coming from in regards to use and features of the a99II.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2017 at 23:03
Originally posted by Roger Rex Roger Rex wrote:

Not sure why Sony would not include this feature, especially when many competitor's cameras include it.

To be fair, there are some Sony features we enjoy that other makers don't provide. Can't have everything.
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artuk View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote artuk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2017 at 23:23
Originally posted by sybersitizen sybersitizen wrote:

That capability does not exist in any A-mount camera. It might exist in some other Sony cameras, or in some smartphone apps for other Sony cameras; but A-mount cameras don't support such apps either.


It exists in E mount via a downloaded "Play Memories" app, for which there is a small charge.

For any "serious" photographer, better results can probably achieved in software post capture.
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artuk View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote artuk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2017 at 23:25
Originally posted by Roger Rex Roger Rex wrote:

sybersitizen - Thanks, have seen that. Not sure why Sony would not include this feature, especially when many competitor's cameras include it. Not the first time that I don't understand where Sony is coming from in regards to use and features of the a99II.


Roger, sorry to be blunt, but E mount is the future (at least as Sony probably sees it), and A mount is something they have to support that doesn't really make much profit, if any over the long term.
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sybersitizen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2017 at 23:28
Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

It exists in E mount via a downloaded "Play Memories" app, for which there is a small charge.

Right. I posted the link earlier.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Roger Rex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2017 at 00:11
Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:




For any "serious" photographer, better results can probably achieved in software   post capture.


I have no idea what you mean by " 'serious' photographer" but as someone who has extensively produced double exposures since the mid 1960's with film and in Photoshop for ten years I know that, for me, being able to see the second exposure overlayed on the first in-camera very substantially would facilitate the process visually. It would reduce the guesswork in terms of the alignment of images by fully revealing where the elements of each exposure fit with each other.   
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sybersitizen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2017 at 00:28
Originally posted by Roger Rex Roger Rex wrote:

I have no idea what you mean by " 'serious' photographer" ...

Maybe it's mostly about the expression:

Serious:


Not so serious:
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addy landzaat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote addy landzaat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2017 at 07:43
Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

Roger, sorry to be blunt, but E mount is the future (at least as Sony probably sees it), and A mount is something they have to support that doesn't really make much profit, if any over the long term.
You might be right, but not everybody agrees with you: Lensrentals said "As recent as 2016, Sony was forecasting growth in the popularity of the A-Mount".

Anyway, here are four cameras that do double exposure in camera, however, as mentioned, it probably is easier in post-processing. (but you need to get some experience with it)
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Post Options Post Options   Quote artuk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2017 at 08:17
Originally posted by addy landzaat addy landzaat wrote:

Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

Roger, sorry to be blunt, but E mount is the future (at least as Sony probably sees it), and A mount is something they have to support that doesn't really make much profit, if any over the long term.
You might be right, but not everybody agrees with you: Lensrentals said "As recent as 2016, Sony was forecasting growth in the popularity of the A-Mount".

Anyway, here are four cameras that do double exposure in camera, however, as mentioned, it probably is easier in post-processing. (but you need to get some experience with it)

I don't know what Lensrentals is basing this assessment on. Sony are #4 in the DSLR market, behind Ricoh Pentax, with about 1% market share. The highest market share they ever reached was about 8-9%, which was many years ago. .

Roger, I understand your point, but merging photos can surely be done with greater control and options in software, that was my point. Having owned another brand camera that could merge multiple exposures, it was difficult to use as the only option was to merge 50/50, no other effects could be applied, and the second shot was merged to a chosen first one and a composite saved - so it wasn't possible to merge the second shot with anything else later. It felt lile a "consumer" feature that lacked the options that for example a professional might require.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Miranda F Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2017 at 15:02
Originally posted by Roger Rex Roger Rex wrote:

Not sure why Sony would not include this feature,

It was included in several Minolta film cameras, though I personally never used it, because it was difficult to fake afterwards in either slide or print film.

With digital it is trivial in PP, so why do it in camera?
There are so many things you'd want to adjust before merging, eg contrast, brightness, colour, WB, etc, that doing a decent job in camera is complex. And do you mask, or add, or take the max value at each pixel?
Unless you're doing a simple peak mix you have to degrade the IQ if you don't want the image to saturate.
Personally I think this is one of those clever but fairly pointless 'features' that are put in consumer cameras to make people pay more. So, well done Sony in not falling for it .
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Post Options Post Options   Quote artuk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2017 at 21:49
Originally posted by Miranda F Miranda F wrote:

Originally posted by Roger Rex Roger Rex wrote:

Not sure why Sony would not include this feature,

It was included in several Minolta film cameras, though I personally never used it, because it was difficult to fake afterwards in either slide or print film.

With digital it is trivial in PP, so why do it in camera?
There are so many things you'd want to adjust before merging, eg contrast, brightness, colour, WB, etc, that doing a decent job in camera is complex. And do you mask, or add, or take the max value at each pixel?
Unless you're doing a simple peak mix you have to degrade the IQ if you don't want the image to saturate.
Personally I think this is one of those clever but fairly pointless 'features' that are put in consumer cameras to make people pay more. So, well done Sony in not falling for it .


What you describe is what I was alluding to as "serious photographers" as opposed to a digital consumer camera "feature". I think it would be much better some in post processing that a simple merge with no control in camera.
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