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The iPad Pro for photography

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wetapunga View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote wetapunga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: The iPad Pro for photography
    Posted: 08 July 2017 at 03:28
Well, I'm giving it a go. The first iterations I thought, fell a bit short of what was needed. The 9.7" had too little RAM and hard-drive, and the 12.9" was too big (for my purposes). My purposes include traveling to, and working in China. That means as much as I welcome working with the cloud, I canít depend on it.

This is why the new versions- especially the 10.5Ē 256 GB model- appealed. It had more RAM, a faster chip and a hard-drive that was on par with some laptops.

The first bonus was discovering it still fitted in my Twelve South Travel Journal, despite the larger size. Itís useful when youíre traveling, get tired and jet-lagged, to have all the vital electronic gear organised and stored in one location. Otherwise stuff gets left behind.

Useful apps for the moment include:

Snapseed: Not only can this convert RAW files, it is also a powerful photo editor. And itís free. Itís not dependent on a cloud connection.

Duet Display: This app means you can use the iPad as a second (or third) monitor for both your PC and Mac. As Iíd gone from dual monitors to a single large 27Ē a few years ago, having this option back is useful. The iPad monitor isnít large, but it is very high quality.

Sony PlayMemories Mobile: a convenient way to interact between camera and iPad

Instagram: enough said. You may or may not like it, but having much more real estate to compose IG posts is useful.

Pcloud: I have a pcloud account. Unlike Google Docs or Dropbox, pcloud isnít (yet) blocked in China. It also comes with a video and audio player, so you can run video clips (say for grandparents) without having to download the files from site. I got in with an offer of 2TB for life. I can put folders of raw files on it, and download any photos for processing in Snapseed.

Zenfolio: the app for my photography website. I imagine other photo hosting sites have similar.

Also, if you have any photography magazines you view digitally, the new screen and size makes these function so much better.

The one problem that remains, is how to get raw files from the cameras, on to the iPad, without having to go through a cloud connection. The ďsend to smartphoneĒ option is great for sending jpegs, but doesnít seem to want to send raw files.
a7R, a77ii | Minolta 17-35mm G, 20mm f2.8, 28mm f2, 35-105mm f3.5-4.5 O, 50mm f2.8 M, 70-210 f4, 85mm f1.4 G, 100mm f2.8 M, 300mm f4 G | Sony CZ16-80mm f3.5-4.5, 70-200mm f2.8 G, 135mm f2.8 STF
 



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artuk View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote artuk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 July 2017 at 10:24
The major issue for me when trying to use an iPad as a photographic tool would be the inability to run most raw development software.

Was there a functional reason (not related to photography) that meant you didn't buy an Ultrabook or convertible, or was it simply an issue of weight or a strong preference for Apple?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote wetapunga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 July 2017 at 11:07
Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

The major issue for me when trying to use an iPad as a photographic tool would be the inability to run most raw development software.


I get that. That's why at least, I was pleased to find that Snapseed could convert raw files. It's surprisingly good. And free. There's still nothing akin to a desktop driven machine running Lightroom.

Was there a functional reason (not related to photography) that meant you didn't buy an Ultrabook or convertible, or was it simply an issue of weight or a strong preference for Apple?


It's mostly an issue of weight. I've used ultrabooks before. But you need to factor in the charger, as well as the ultra book. And the different international-plug adapters. And by carrying less computer gear I can carry more photographic . I can recharge an iPad if I can find a USB port, or even from a portable battery charger. (Albeit you do need ones that work at the higher 'juice' that iPads require). Laptops are less convenient that way.

Another issue is that in the past, I've never had time to do much photo editing or the like when traveling, so having an ultra book that runs Lightroom ended up being redundant. Mostly I just need to cull the bad shots and select the keepers. In principle I can do that from the iPad.

I've got no great attachment to Apple. They just seem to have the best tablets that can almost function as a laptop at the moment.
a7R, a77ii | Minolta 17-35mm G, 20mm f2.8, 28mm f2, 35-105mm f3.5-4.5 O, 50mm f2.8 M, 70-210 f4, 85mm f1.4 G, 100mm f2.8 M, 300mm f4 G | Sony CZ16-80mm f3.5-4.5, 70-200mm f2.8 G, 135mm f2.8 STF
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Post Options Post Options   Quote artuk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 July 2017 at 12:46
Originally posted by wetapunga wetapunga wrote:

Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

The major issue for me when trying to use an iPad as a photographic tool would be the inability to run most raw development software.


I get that. That's why at least, I was pleased to find that Snapseed could convert raw files. It's surprisingly good. And free. There's still nothing akin to a desktop driven machine running Lightroom.

Was there a functional reason (not related to photography) that meant you didn't buy an Ultrabook or convertible, or was it simply an issue of weight or a strong preference for Apple?


It's mostly an issue of weight. I've used ultrabooks before. But you need to factor in the charger, as well as the ultra book. And the different international-plug adapters. And by carrying less computer gear I can carry more photographic . I can recharge an iPad if I can find a USB port, or even from a portable battery charger. (Albeit you do need ones that work at the higher 'juice' that iPads require). Laptops are less convenient that way.

Another issue is that in the past, I've never had time to do much photo editing or the like when traveling, so having an ultra book that runs Lightroom ended up being redundant. Mostly I just need to cull the bad shots and select the keepers. In principle I can do that from the iPad.

I've got no great attachment to Apple. They just seem to have the best tablets that can almost function as a laptop at the moment.


I didn't know Snapseed worked from raw - the last time I looked it didn't have the ability, and to be honest the version I saw was pretty terrible.

There are windows machines that charge from USB-c now, and with very long battery life. LG makes an ultrabook that weights under 1kg!

I do a lot of editing "on the road" so my choice is an Ultrabook or convertible because of the software and greater processing power.

Personal choice, I was just curious if you chose an iPad as a photographic tool, or for other reasons with a bit of photo stuff on the side.

The big issue with raw development software is that its VERY processor intensive (millions of calculations for every pixel every time.you change something). It's probably why raw development software hasn't been ported to iOS, because the processor maybe isn't powerful enough. A windows device that can edit documents or browse the net for maybe 10 hours only develops raw files for perhaps 3, because it uses so much processor power. That's true of MacBooks too as the hardware is the same.

You can run editing software on some lower end windows tablets with Intel Atom.chipsets, as the processors support 64 bit instruction sets and hyper threading. They have good performance for everyday tasks, but only "ok" performance at demanding tasks like photo editing. Not aimed at you, just general chit chat.
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wetapunga View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote wetapunga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 July 2017 at 00:58
Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:


I didn't know Snapseed worked from raw - the last time I looked it didn't have the ability, and to be honest the version I saw was pretty terrible.


Software/apps are always a bit of a moving target to try to judge. I understand the raw converter is relatively recent. I did try it out by downloading a raw file from p-cloud (it had some tricky exposure elements), adjusting it (WB, exposure, some dodge/burning & cropping) and within a couple of minutes, had something as good as I'd get from Lightroom.

The iPad's touch screen is good- really good- for making adjustments with brushes btw.

It's not up to batch-processing as far as I can tell. But it is functional for single photos you want to work on. (And it's free).

Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

There are windows machines that charge from USB-c now, and with very long battery life. LG makes an ultrabook that weights under 1kg!


Interesting. I did not know that. The LG isn't available here though, and it's kind of an outlier. Most ultrabooks are still larger than an iPad, and weigh more than 1kg. The iPad Pro is 469g. That's the difference between being able to take an extra lens (or not).

Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

I do a lot of editing "on the road" so my choice is an Ultrabook or convertible because of the software and greater processing power.


Understood. I did like my ultrabook (Lenovo X1) for that processing power and software. It is though an expensive option for me, as I do 99% of my editing at home (on a desktop).

So if you look at the increase in cost for an option I'd use very rarely, then iPad looks more rational. (Especially as the iPad works as a second monitor for the PC).

I suspect for people who want to be able to (mostly) store, view, cull (and even show off photos) on the move, an iPad Pro starts to be more attractive.

Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

Personal choice, I was just curious if you chose an iPad as a photographic tool, or for other reasons with a bit of photo stuff on the side.


I'll concede when I'm traveling for 30+ hours, or get stuck at airports with cancelled flights, being able to watch HD movies on a high quality screen is also appealing.

Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

The big issue with raw development software is that its VERY processor intensive (millions of calculations for every pixel every time.you change something). It's probably why raw development software hasn't been ported to iOS, because the processor maybe isn't powerful enough.


I think that's why it's only now people are taking the iPad Pro seriously. The A10X chip is really good. It's not just a marginal improvement over the older A8 or A9. Throw in the now, 4G RAM of the device and you can manage some respectable photo-editing. It's not going to match my desktop, but a lot of low-end windows devices can't anyway.    

Originally posted by artuk artuk wrote:

You can run editing software on some lower end windows tablets with Intel Atom.chipsets, as the processors support 64 bit instruction sets and hyper threading. They have good performance for everyday tasks, but only "ok" performance at demanding tasks like photo editing. Not aimed at you, just general chit chat.


Nice chat too. Fwiw, I did try out my wife's older generation Samsung tablet. Just to consider the options (and have a Windows 10/Lightroom option). I'd say the A10X chip in the iPad Pro leaves the Samsung's atom well behind. It was way too sluggish.

Also the build quality of the iPad pro feels far more solid than the Samsung.

Edited by wetapunga - 09 July 2017 at 02:27
a7R, a77ii | Minolta 17-35mm G, 20mm f2.8, 28mm f2, 35-105mm f3.5-4.5 O, 50mm f2.8 M, 70-210 f4, 85mm f1.4 G, 100mm f2.8 M, 300mm f4 G | Sony CZ16-80mm f3.5-4.5, 70-200mm f2.8 G, 135mm f2.8 STF
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Post Options Post Options   Quote wetapunga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 August 2017 at 05:20
For what it is worth, this is what the setup looks like using the iPad Pro as a second monitor. (The main monitor is 27").

The app is "Duet Display" and it works with both Mac and Windows machines.


One bonus is being able to freely rotate the iPad from portrait to landscape mode, to match the orientation of the photo
a7R, a77ii | Minolta 17-35mm G, 20mm f2.8, 28mm f2, 35-105mm f3.5-4.5 O, 50mm f2.8 M, 70-210 f4, 85mm f1.4 G, 100mm f2.8 M, 300mm f4 G | Sony CZ16-80mm f3.5-4.5, 70-200mm f2.8 G, 135mm f2.8 STF
 



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Post Options Post Options   Quote jkp1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 August 2017 at 08:14
There are quite a numbers of raw-apps for iPad nowadays, snapseed is only one of them, so no restrictions to jpeg only anymore.
Works really fine...
And the interface iPad/apple pen is superior in feel and usability
Not using: A700, A77, 24-105, 28-135, FE28-70, LA-EA2, 35SAM, 16-50
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Post Options Post Options   Quote wetapunga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2017 at 02:08
Originally posted by jkp1 jkp1 wrote:

There are quite a numbers of raw-apps for iPad nowadays, snapseed is only one of them, so no restrictions to jpeg only anymore.
Works really fine...
And the interface iPad/apple pen is superior in feel and usability


I've found the mobile version of Adobe LR to be somewhat frustrating. It exports or renders images in a pretty compressed jpeg size. Which I guess makes sense for people using phones or devices with limited storage. But a raw file I can turn into a 22MB jpeg on my PC version of lightroom, becomes a 2-3MB compressed jpeg on the mobile version. Even if I specify maximum size.

Snapseed at least, will export the raw file (using the open-in) function. But the edits are destructive, and I can't add keywords.

I might try PhotoRaw - especially if it allows keywords to be added.

a7R, a77ii | Minolta 17-35mm G, 20mm f2.8, 28mm f2, 35-105mm f3.5-4.5 O, 50mm f2.8 M, 70-210 f4, 85mm f1.4 G, 100mm f2.8 M, 300mm f4 G | Sony CZ16-80mm f3.5-4.5, 70-200mm f2.8 G, 135mm f2.8 STF
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Post Options Post Options   Quote RvdM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2017 at 08:45
Originally posted by wetapunga wetapunga wrote:

Originally posted by jkp1 jkp1 wrote:

There are quite a numbers of raw-apps for iPad nowadays, snapseed is only one of them, so no restrictions to jpeg only anymore.
Works really fine...
And the interface iPad/apple pen is superior in feel and usability


I've found the mobile version of Adobe LR to be somewhat frustrating. It exports or renders images in a pretty compressed jpeg size. Which I guess makes sense for people using phones or devices with limited storage. But a raw file I can turn into a 22MB jpeg on my PC version of lightroom, becomes a 2-3MB compressed jpeg on the mobile version. Even if I specify maximum size.

Snapseed at least, will export the raw file (using the open-in) function. But the edits are destructive, and I can't add keywords.

I might try PhotoRaw - especially if it allows keywords to be added.



Lightroom mobile uses the smart previews (approx 2-3mpix) which are synced by the creative cloud software. The full size raw's will stay on your computer.
I do not know what is happening when you copied the raw's to your ipad by the camera connection kit.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote wetapunga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2017 at 09:26
Originally posted by RvdM RvdM wrote:

Originally posted by wetapunga wetapunga wrote:

Originally posted by jkp1 jkp1 wrote:

There are quite a numbers of raw-apps for iPad nowadays, snapseed is only one of them, so no restrictions to jpeg only anymore.
Works really fine...
And the interface iPad/apple pen is superior in feel and usability


I've found the mobile version of Adobe LR to be somewhat frustrating. It exports or renders images in a pretty compressed jpeg size. Which I guess makes sense for people using phones or devices with limited storage. But a raw file I can turn into a 22MB jpeg on my PC version of lightroom, becomes a 2-3MB compressed jpeg on the mobile version. Even if I specify maximum size.

Snapseed at least, will export the raw file (using the open-in) function. But the edits are destructive, and I can't add keywords.

I might try PhotoRaw - especially if it allows keywords to be added.



Lightroom mobile uses the smart previews (approx 2-3mpix) which are synced by the creative cloud software. The full size raw's will stay on your computer.
I do not know what is happening when you copied the raw's to your ipad by the camera connection kit.


That's correct. Adobe Mobile Lightroom, like many other apps, uses the jpeg smart preview that's embedded in the RAW file. I'm not quite sure what the point of that is. I suppose its more about 'mobile' photography and less about being a PC replacement.

Snapseed does not seem as limited, but isn't flawless. I would like to find one app at least, that gives the option of generating full-sized JPEG files from the *.ARW files.

It's not that I intend replacing my PC with the iPad Pro, but it could be handy when I'm traveling.
a7R, a77ii | Minolta 17-35mm G, 20mm f2.8, 28mm f2, 35-105mm f3.5-4.5 O, 50mm f2.8 M, 70-210 f4, 85mm f1.4 G, 100mm f2.8 M, 300mm f4 G | Sony CZ16-80mm f3.5-4.5, 70-200mm f2.8 G, 135mm f2.8 STF
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Post Options Post Options   Quote RvdM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2017 at 09:52
Originally posted by wetapunga wetapunga wrote:



That's correct. Adobe Mobile Lightroom, like many other apps, uses the jpeg smart preview that's embedded in the RAW file.


As far as I know, my lightroom desktop applications makes new smart previews. It is not the embedded jpeg from the camera.

This smart preview should give you more data to do adjustments to the image. For example, white balance gives me full edit options.
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