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Open Letter To Sony

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NIKO View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote NIKO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Open Letter To Sony
    Posted: 18 August 2021 at 15:54
To Sony,

I'm an avid photographer and I use A-Mount. I realize that you (Sony) have discontinued the A-Mount based cameras and the lenses are obviously to follow. However, here are my hopes and suggestions:

1) If A-Mount is truly to be rid of then make an E-Mount camera that is by far more DSLR like in physical appearance and ergonomics like the "Olympus OM-D E-M1X Mirrorless Digital Camera." It is mirrorless, but looks like a traditional DSLR. It's ergonomics makes sense and Sony should really have a few camera models that look like an A99II, but is mirrorless. Then, make sure that the new "Sony LA-EA5 A-Mount to E-Mount Adapter" actually works with all of your E-Mount cameras with a firmware update. If all of them can't be updated then update ALL that can be.

2) This is something I'd like to see, but I won't hold my breath. Continue making an A-Mount camera, but a mirrorless one. An A99III comes to mind. Have one and only one come out every 3 to 4 years as technology improves. This would be a camera for all A-Mount users to use and have for their current glass. Also, there is still a large after market for used A-Mount lenses. If a new camera comes out once in a while people may very well still buy. I would. We love our Minolta/Sony A-Mount glass. In addition, maybe keep a few A-Mount lenses on the market. All of the "Zeiss" and "G" lenses come to mind. Be rid of everything else including all of the APS-C lenses.

These are just my thoughts. If any others on the forum wish to add their thoughts please do. However, let's not turn this into a debate on whether or not to keep an A-Mount camera. I'm just throwing my thoughts out there for Sony to read and I hope there are others out there who feel the same way that are willing to add their thoughts to the thread.


Regards,
NIKO

Edited by NIKO - 17 September 2021 at 13:52
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2manycamera View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote 2manycamera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2021 at 18:45
While it may have limited use in actually effecting Sony, I'm still happy to see your letter and will add my two cents.

Point one is actually two subjects: DSLR shape and LA-EA5 compatibility.

Sony actually did address the ergonomics in a lamentable entry camera-the a3000. This was a horrid little camera that felt fabulous in hand. Made to sell for cheap, they basically took the a68 shell, shrunk it a bit and sprinkled in sub par components (except for the sensor which was pretty good). If today they took all the features of the a6600 and put them into an updated, better made, modern a3000 type body, I would buy one immediately. This wouldn't be full frame, but it would be a way to gauge interest in the more traditional body shape.

When it comes to compatibility with the LA-EA5 and screw mount lenses, Sony, what is the point of limiting it to so few cameras!? I get that older cameras, like my a7Rii, may not have the kind of processor needed but why not the a7c? Every camera introduced after the LA-EA5 intro should offer full compatibility and any other that can be updated through firmware should get the update. End of rant.

2. You're correct, don't hold your breath.... Not an issue of would, should or could. It's simply a won't. As much as I agree with you, Sony has made it obvious that they don't.

Thanks again for your letter and giving me an opportunity to add to it.

Bill
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Post Options Post Options   Quote der dickgg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2021 at 19:57
Still waiting for the A88, a cheaper version of the A99-II. Full-frame offcourse. And when will the A78 see the daylight? The supposed follow-up for the A77-II.
STILL WAITING!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote addy landzaat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2021 at 20:48
Keep waiting

I do understand why the Olympus OM-D E-M1X is the one referred to. I never saw one in real life, but they feel like unnecessary big. If you want a build in vertical grip, the Canon R3 seems to hit a nice middle ground. Or simply a A99m2 (A77/A77m2) with E-mount.

The latest A7 cameras are fine, but the A99m2 is better I think.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote momech Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2021 at 21:01
Personally , I think Sony could have released the LA-EA 5 adapter when the began releasing the full frame E mount bodies, the simply didn't want to. Much more profitable to get everyone to invest in the new system. They took action when Canon released their R5 ff mirror less body and the EF mount adapter. The body and it's AF system are in some respects better than anything before the Sony A1, and their adapter is not only better but considerably cheaper. Canon definitely lived up to their reputation for taking care of their customers, and Sony lived up to theirs of only caring when forced to.   
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Post Options Post Options   Quote skm.sa100 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2021 at 21:10
Continuation of A77 line and A99 line would be good enough.
I don't think they'll invest money into any more R&D but at least keeping these two bodies into future would definitely make me happy.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote LAbernethy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2021 at 00:29
Originally posted by skm.sa100 skm.sa100 wrote:

Continuation of A77 line and A99 line would be good enough.
I don't think they'll invest money into any more R&D but at least keeping these two bodies into future would definitely make me happy.

There was no reason to stop the A99II production. By their own press releases sales exceeded their expectations. It would cost little to put it back in production. They still make new a6000 's for sake!! Since the a99II is an A77II with a full frame sensor I don't know if they need to keep both lines going but they do have an A7III and an A7RIV, and that doesn't bother them.

Edited by LAbernethy - 19 August 2021 at 01:40
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MinoltaMad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2021 at 06:53
Always a heated and hot topic area I imagine to stir the blood. I think sadly as mentioned above, the A-mount is no longer so my comments will follow with that assumption....

- ergonomics/size/design - new iterations of the a7, a9 and a1 range gradually tweak to a compromise between what Sony thinks (current) and what users would like above (a more balanced robust design which is still small and light but isn't weird with the larger lenses and has a DSLR type shout out)

- firmware/software updates. Sony could distinguish themselves as leaders and also then make their loyal customer base into raving fans rather than the feeling of being buy/sell and forget as currently is the case; I mean Apple as an example still supports down to at least the iPhone 7 (2016 release) with OS updates!!!! Sony seems to have a fear that this will stifle people upgrading - it might a little in immediate continuity but it creates a much more stable loyal customer base longterm - the customer who owns an a7RIV currently may not get the a7RV but would get the a7R* later on - supported by little updates in features keeps everyone feeling they get value for a $3000-$5000 outlay. It would also allow for complaints within the system to be addressed - like menu layout logic etc. They need to shift from a firmware that is camera specific to a common platform (which it clearly could be and must be already), run support friar updates yearly for the more expensive models (like a7 range and above) and continue to support for x number of years (3-4 years) OR when the next new model comes out in the range such as the a1 has recently the whole range gets the common updates and features; they could easily still support the a99mk2 or have with more than one puny firmware update; they could prioritise user key features - 1) menu layout updates 2) improved focus algorithms 3) sensor/noise/signal processing. Heck - I'd even pay a subscription fee of up to $50 annually for a software/firmware update with worthwhile changes; they could totally do this with the a99mk2 still given it's internal hardware is a7rIII effective equivalent. They could easily build interest in their new camera releases as well by making a campaign - new camera coming out and software update for all these models......it just takes a little bit of flexibility/out of the box/messiness to get this sorted and unfortunately at the core this is an historical ethos of lack of messy and very traditional non flexible thinking. What does marketing speak call this - being agile....sorry if that makes a little bit of sick come up ;)

- adaptor - LA-EA5 - not hard like the above to cover all the complaints around camera bodies and lens compatibility with the previous point - update with a common firmware platform; also one more iteration of this - LA-EA6. Would really cost them much. I'm an A-mount currently but I will be going to E-mount in the next 12-24months. What's the drive? I really have the need/want for the 200-600 G Zoom. However - as an example - I used my 70-200 G2 a mount with LA-EA5 on a a7RIV then compared the 70-200 GM and other than me having a good copy of A mount G2 there is very little in size/weight/image quality to ever warrant a shift for me in the short term....yes the focus was moderately quicker.....expensive glass is the most significant investment for the customer base.....

Rant over
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Post Options Post Options   Quote nandbytes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2021 at 07:42
A interesting range of opinions.... personally I would not like a larger body. Would never own the R3/Z9 for this reason. I like to think more people (I mean Sony customers) are on my side of the fence than the "large DSLR body" side which is why A1 is the size it is.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Swede66 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2021 at 08:03
As a Sony/minolta faithful, I would like Sony to release a firmware update for the A99m2 at least. If they want to show a real sign of appreciation for us loyals, one for the a77m2 also. It's a shame they dropped the updates for these fantastic cameras.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pegelli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2021 at 08:32
I'm with Anand on this, I think the ergonomics of the current A7/9/1 bodies are fine for me. I don't need a vertical grip or grip extension. For that matter I liked the original A7 body best if it weren't for the bit awkward placement of the exposure button. And yes I know ergonomics are very personal so I fully understand people who want a different shape or body style.

But I'm always a bit surprised about the praise for oher brands because they "seem to be taking care of customers better than Sony". Yes, I would like for the LA-EA5 to work fully on my A7ii and A7Rii but I dont blame Sony for not having a firmware upgrade to do this. The camera I bought still works exactly as designed the day I bought it and that's the deal I got into . Sony never promised future updates or new compatible gadgets.

It seems people think when buying a Sony camera the company is obliged to keep producing compatible gadgets or more advanced models to cater to their needs. Indeed some other brands seem to do that more than Sony but if that is really important I would do my research upfront and buy the brand that has the policy that is most aligned with my expectations.   

Edited by pegelli - 19 August 2021 at 08:37
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Post Options Post Options   Quote nandbytes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2021 at 08:51
Originally posted by pegelli pegelli wrote:


But I'm always a bit surprised about the praise for oher brands because they "seem to be taking care of customers better than Sony". Yes, I would like for the LA-EA5 to work fully on my A7ii and A7Rii but I dont blame Sony for not having a firmware upgrade to do this. The camera I bought still works exactly as designed the day I bought it and that's the deal I got into . Sony never promised future updates or new compatible gadgets.


In all honesty having used Z7 and R5 a fair bit they are more comfortable than A1/A7RIV/A7RIII. R5 has other issues I won't go into but Nikon Z7 is probably the best mirrorless body I have used in terms of ergonomics and its no bigger than the A1 or A7 series (with IBIS).
So I do not think the current Sony lot are the best for ergonomics but improving doesn't necessarily mean increasing its size. Just means copying Nikon Z7

My problem with LA-EA5 is they still don't allow use of TCs and that's a massive deal breaker for me. If it did would have looked into getting a 300mm f2.8 which are more affordable these days. Considering the LA-EA4 converted adapter can support TCs, I do not see why Sony are purposely crippling EA5.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pegelli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2021 at 09:20
Originally posted by nandbytes nandbytes wrote:


In all honesty having used Z7 and R5 a fair bit they are more comfortable than A1/A7RIV/A7RIII. R5 has other issues I won't go into but Nikon Z7 is probably the best mirrorless body I have used in terms of ergonomics and its no bigger than the A1 or A7 series (with IBIS).
So I do not think the current Sony lot are the best for ergonomics but improving doesn't necessarily mean increasing its size. Just means copying Nikon Z7
This again shows that ergonomics is very personal, I've not used any of the Canon mirrorless but did use a Z6 from a friend and my conclusion on that one is the same as most other Nikon's I've held, i.e. very uncomfortable. The viewfinder was great however and so were the files but in my hands the sony mirrorless bodies just feel so much better. And the Nikon menu just confused the hell out of me, but that's probably because I'm used to the Sony menus by now


Originally posted by nandbytes nandbytes wrote:


My problem with LA-EA5 is they still don't allow use of TCs and that's a massive deal breaker for me. If it did would have looked into getting a 300mm f2.8 which are more affordable these days. Considering the LA-EA4 converted adapter can support TCs, I do not see why Sony are purposely crippling EA5.
For me the glass of the LA-EA5 is at least 90% full, and if you get a Kenko DG 300 converter without a chip you still get excellent IQ and it works well on all Sony LA-EA adapters. Taking that into account maybe I should even have said the glass is 95% full

Edited by pegelli - 19 August 2021 at 10:05
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Post Options Post Options   Quote addy landzaat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2021 at 09:44
ATM Sony has arguably the best backward compatibility re. lenses from any camera maker. With the LA-EA5 you can use lenses from 1987 and on, Canon from 1989 and Nikon from 1996. (Maybe one could argue Pentax has better backward compatibility).

Also, I think that the idea that Sony could have released the LA-EA 5 adapter when they began releasing the full frame E mount bodies and that they simply didn't want to, is wrong. It would've been easier for Sony to ease people into the new system with a screw-driven adaptor. E-mount really took off when there were good Canon adaptors. I think that in the beginning there were legitimate engineering problems. Maybe they could have introduced it earlier, but I am sure the LA-EA1/3 was easier to design.

Sony is in business to make money. I doubt they make a lot of money from the LA-EA5 and the number of A-mount users is limited. I think it is therefore commendable Sony released it. Even if they could have done it earlier.

Those are my 0,02
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