"Birdscapes" - does it work?
Printed From: Dyxum.com
Category: Dyxum Photographs
Forum Name: Dyxum Critics Corner
Forum Description: Provide your own analysis and seek detailed feedback from the membership
URL: https://www.dyxum.com/dforum/forum_posts.asp?TID=136294
Printed Date: 16 February 2025 at 18:14
Topic: "Birdscapes" - does it work?
Posted By: nandbytes
Subject: "Birdscapes" - does it work?
Date Posted: 25 October 2019 at 00:00
First time in part of the world (i.e. critics corner), so bear with me....
I don't know if this is something that's been done to death or common or if it even works (may be its a terrible idea)
But its something I have tried to "see" and photograph a few times when the setting allows for it. I have a few pictures of birds but in a more landscape-like setting than a the standard get as close as possible shots!
#1

#2

#3 - same as above with selective colour for obvious reason. if selective colour feels like -> I don't blame you

#4 - less leafy and more watery setting (though I am pretty sure this is common)

if people feel I should stop wasting time go back to what I normally do and get close to these I shall also oblige 
------------- https://agclicks.com/ - AG Photography A7RV, 20-70G, 70-200GII, Viltrox16mm/1.8, 35/1.4GM, Sammy85/1.4II, 500DN
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Replies:
Posted By: pegelli
Date Posted: 25 October 2019 at 08:31
I like them Anand, the first the pose of the Egret is special and the frame of nature around is helping to bring that out. I also like the original version of the kingfisher, for me the fall colours in the background add an extra colour contrast with the bird that the selective coloured version misses. The selective coloured version feels lees "natural" to me which I'm not sure is something you want to achieve. The fourth is just nice, not filling the whole frame with this type of background is indeed more common.
I think there is no right or wrong between close vs. providing the environment/context, both have their place and can result in good photo's.
------------- You can see the April Foolishness 2023 exhibition https://www.dyxum.com/dforum/april-foolishness-2023-the-exhibition_topic142439.html - here Another great show of the talent we have on Dyxum
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Posted By: Miranda F
Date Posted: 25 October 2019 at 12:43
Absolutely! I agree, and not only because I don't have the lenses (or the skill and patience ) to get amazing close-ups. I like your pictures, Anand, and I think the ones you show here are almost perfectly framed. I'd only comment that I personally find human and animal subjects look better looking to the centre from a short distance away (not necessarily the 1/3 often suggested) so I would probably put the heron a bit to the left and the razorbills nearer the centre.
Interestingly, I've been thinking exactly the same as you about train pictures. Almost everyone seems to want either close-ups or tight crops from further away (and to be fair they've been doing this for a century) but I prefer to see the train in a setting. Tight crops are okay of you're making an identification guide, or if you're hoping to wow your audience with your skill at getting close-ups, but they can get terribly boring and it's also very far from how most of us actually see birds (or trains). So, no, Anand, don't give up your concept - run with it, explore more or less, and keep us in the loop!
------------- Miranda F & Sensorex, Sony A7Rii, A58, Nex-6, Dynax 4, 5, 60, 500si/600si/700si/800si, various Sony & Minolta lenses, several Tamrons, lots of MF primes and *far* too many old film cameras ...
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Posted By: nandbytes
Date Posted: 26 October 2019 at 09:19
Thank you folks for commenting 
As for the Kingfisher my missus said she could barely notice it so I felt selectively colouring would help that 
But personally I prefer the selectively coloured one simply because I think its the only place where it actually doesn't seem too cheesy and adds a sombre look/feel to the picture.
@Miranda: Interesting you should mention not having enough reach/lenses. These were taken with the same lenses I take close-ups with. First one was shot at 560mm and kingfisher at 600mm.
I actually find its really hard to find a setting that works for such pictures. Simply zooming out to 100-200mm from a close-up picture/framing just results in a tiny bird with rubbish background and ambiance.
Interesting point on trains, I will explore this also 
------------- https://agclicks.com/ - AG Photography A7RV, 20-70G, 70-200GII, Viltrox16mm/1.8, 35/1.4GM, Sammy85/1.4II, 500DN
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Posted By: Hezu
Date Posted: 26 October 2019 at 11:19
I think I will voice a nod more critical opinions on these:
1. Perhaps bit too central composition and despite that these are "birdscapes" I think tighter framing might been better...
2. & 3. Somehow I think that the position of the bird in the frame should be different: perhaps more conformant with the rule of thirds and the bird closer to the right edge.
3. As a positive thing: the selective colouring works fine.
4. In its current form this is quite boring picture IMHO. I think lower shooting angle would have made this more interesting.
------------- http://hezu.1g.fi/ - Galerie Hezu
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Posted By: stevo71
Date Posted: 26 October 2019 at 11:40
I like a pulled back bird shot that showcases the environment as much as the bird especially when composed well.
------------- a99ii | Tamron 90mm f/2.8 | Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 | Sony 50mm f/1.4 | Tamron 24-70mm f/2.8 | CZ 16-35mm f/2.8 | Sony 70-400mm G2
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Posted By: Kilkry
Date Posted: 26 October 2019 at 12:34
I quite like these. The norm is bird faces close up, "tight crop", and "birdscapes" are a nice alternative. I agree with Hez on nr 1, at least that the bird would perhaps fit better some ways down and to the left.
Now where is that Oktoberfest..
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Posted By: nandbytes
Date Posted: 26 October 2019 at 21:09
Thank you folk for commenting. As for the framing these are straight out of the camera (been trying to compose as much as possible in camera). But there's plenty of pixel in there to cropin and re-frame.
As per advice above I have reframed #1-3 to be more rule of thirds friendly (#4 was just meant to be an example of something I felt was more common than first 3)
#1m2

#2m2

#3m2

------------- https://agclicks.com/ - AG Photography A7RV, 20-70G, 70-200GII, Viltrox16mm/1.8, 35/1.4GM, Sammy85/1.4II, 500DN
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Posted By: Fred_S
Date Posted: 27 October 2019 at 08:26
For me the m2 versions work slightly better, still showing enough of the environment, but just a bit more emphasis on the birds.
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Posted By: nandbytes
Date Posted: 27 October 2019 at 11:43
if I may say so in case of the kingfishers I like second re-done version (a little more cropping could also work). In case of the Heron I prefer my original despite mostly central composition (I am not one to follow rules )
------------- https://agclicks.com/ - AG Photography A7RV, 20-70G, 70-200GII, Viltrox16mm/1.8, 35/1.4GM, Sammy85/1.4II, 500DN
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Posted By: Dena
Date Posted: 27 October 2019 at 18:18
I appreciate a tight detailed bird photo, but like them in environment better. They can still be large in the photo in that case as well. I see it as documentary versus story telling.
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Posted By: Miranda F
Date Posted: 30 October 2019 at 06:07
Fred_S wrote:
For me the m2 versions work slightly better, still showing enough of the environment, but just a bit more emphasis on the birds. | +1
------------- Miranda F & Sensorex, Sony A7Rii, A58, Nex-6, Dynax 4, 5, 60, 500si/600si/700si/800si, various Sony & Minolta lenses, several Tamrons, lots of MF primes and *far* too many old film cameras ...
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Posted By: nandbytes
Date Posted: 10 December 2019 at 23:22
Continuing on the theme, this has got be my recent favourite...

------------- https://agclicks.com/ - AG Photography A7RV, 20-70G, 70-200GII, Viltrox16mm/1.8, 35/1.4GM, Sammy85/1.4II, 500DN
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Posted By: Miranda F
Date Posted: 11 December 2019 at 16:30
Yes ... works for me! He's just saying ... the centre of the picture is just *there*.
------------- Miranda F & Sensorex, Sony A7Rii, A58, Nex-6, Dynax 4, 5, 60, 500si/600si/700si/800si, various Sony & Minolta lenses, several Tamrons, lots of MF primes and *far* too many old film cameras ...
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Posted By: svjetlana
Date Posted: 11 December 2019 at 16:51
The last one certainly works very fine as well as 1m2. 2m2 I find too small for the frame. I am very fond of this type of bird photography. It works similar to human environmental portraiture.
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Posted By: Atom Ant
Date Posted: 11 December 2019 at 18:10
Your last shot -
To return to the original question, yes, the approach works. FWIW I prefer it to more conventional approaches. And I expect it would be more saleable if that's relevant.
------------- No need for formality - call me Tony! https://www.flickr.com/photos/127074758@N06/ - My Flickr Photostream
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Posted By: Hezu
Date Posted: 11 December 2019 at 19:27
The newest looks quite nice. Since we are in critics corner, I have to say that the partially shown branch in the bottom left bothers me a bit.
------------- http://hezu.1g.fi/ - Galerie Hezu
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Posted By: nandbytes
Date Posted: 15 December 2019 at 20:36
Thank you all for the compliments and critiques.
I agree I dislike some of the "stray" branches at the bottom and its a little distracting to the composition which is flowing diagonally inc. the birds beak.
I have cloned them out, and might it out now
------------- https://agclicks.com/ - AG Photography A7RV, 20-70G, 70-200GII, Viltrox16mm/1.8, 35/1.4GM, Sammy85/1.4II, 500DN
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Posted By: digiton
Date Posted: 24 May 2020 at 21:10
?
------------- A7R4 and A9II with glass from 10mm to 600mm http://www.flickr.com/photos/digiton2008 - my flickr I use google translator to translate
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Posted By: nandbytes
Date Posted: 24 May 2020 at 22:45
digiton wrote:
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??
------------- https://agclicks.com/ - AG Photography A7RV, 20-70G, 70-200GII, Viltrox16mm/1.8, 35/1.4GM, Sammy85/1.4II, 500DN
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Posted By: digiton
Date Posted: 25 May 2020 at 04:56
nandbytes wrote:
digiton wrote:
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wrong topic
------------- A7R4 and A9II with glass from 10mm to 600mm http://www.flickr.com/photos/digiton2008 - my flickr I use google translator to translate
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