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5600HS(D) sync problem

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Phil Wood View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phil Wood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 5600HS(D) sync problem
    Posted: 14 December 2018 at 18:53
I have one of these flashes, but it does not illuminate shots taken with it, even though it triggers and flashes. I have tried it with long (1/3s) exposure time both front and rear curtain. I am bewildered that its light does not appear in any shot.

Am I being stupid? Any ideas?
 



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Basil View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Basil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 December 2018 at 19:03
What are the settings you are using for the flash?
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sybersitizen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 December 2018 at 19:08
Which camera(s) have you tried this with? You're testing the flash shoe-mounted (not wireless) and in M mode (not TTL) to minimize variables?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phil Wood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 December 2018 at 00:02
I've tried it on several cameras (A58. A77 & A900) all hot shoe, TTL. I shall try in M mode and report back.
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Phil Wood View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phil Wood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 December 2018 at 00:15
Okay - tried it with A77 & A900 - on both the flash switches to TTL as soon as it goes on the camera and doesn't respond to the Mode button ie it won't switch to manual.

So I need to check the manual! I also need sleep, so I'll try again in the morning!
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sybersitizen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 December 2018 at 00:34
Originally posted by Phil Wood Phil Wood wrote:

... the flash switches to TTL as soon as it goes on the camera and doesn't respond to the Mode button ie it won't switch to manual.

So I need to check the manual!

Yes, you do. The procedure for making all flash modes available in all exposure modes is toward the end of the manual under Custom Function.
 



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Post Options Post Options   Quote michelb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 December 2018 at 01:19
If your bodies are set in WL mode, very little light is being emitted since they are then trying to control other flash units. Your bodies need to be set in forced flash mode.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phil Wood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 December 2018 at 09:42
Ohay.

I have set the flash into M mode (thanks for the pointer sybersitizen) and I can now take pictures with it (so partial success). I have to set everything manually but it shows that sync is not the problem.

With the body (A900) in Fill-flash mode (forced flash?) and the flash in TTL mode the picture returns to the all to familiar gloom.



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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 December 2018 at 18:58
You haven't said how long you've owned the flash. Is it something you just got? Was it ever working with your digital cameras in the past?

sorry, unintentionally edited the wrong post


Edited by stiuskr - 15 December 2018 at 20:03
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Post Options Post Options   Quote stiuskr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 December 2018 at 20:05
Cleaning the contacts on the foot and shoe wouldn't hurt, might even help.
Also google "5600HS-D underexposure", there's quite a few results that pop up with some saying the 5600HS needed firmware updating with the then new Sony cameras.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phil Wood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 December 2018 at 12:18
It's a recent acquisition and has never worked properly with the cameras I have tried it on. It may be faulty - or I may be faulty!   

According to Sony it does not support TTL mode in my cameras - https://www.sony.com.au/support/resources/en_AP/html/Compatibility/DSLR/Flash/konica/5600hs.html it is not compatible with my A77 or A900 in TTL mode (presumably the same incompatibility applies to the A58, but the compatibility chart predates its release).

This is, presumably, because the camera (A900) does not have a TTL mode - just ADI & P-TTL. The flash supports these apparently, but does not have an ADI or P-TTL setting in the menu. Back to the manuals!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 December 2018 at 16:10
Originally posted by Phil Wood Phil Wood wrote:

It's a recent acquisition and has never worked properly with the cameras I have tried it on. It may be faulty - or I may be faulty!

Sounds like the flash is faulty. My two 5600HS(D)s have been working flawlessly for years with my A55 and A77. The flash supports TTL metering with every A-mount body. Every one of them, even the newer ones that require the flash shoe adapter.

This is, presumably, because the camera (A900) does not have a TTL mode - just ADI & P-TTL. The flash supports these apparently, but does not have an ADI or P-TTL setting in the menu.

Once again, you're describing all A-mount bodies. And it doesn't matter if you choose ADI or P-TTL in the camera because TTL flash metering will work either way. Once again, owners of all A-mount bodies have been using that flash with TTL metering for years!

The incompatibility row in Sony's chart refers only to the fact that real-time-off-the-sensor TTL is not available. That's not available with any digital camera. It's a film camera thing. All digital cameras require pre-flash TTL (P-TTL), which the flash of course supports.

Back to the manuals!

Not necessary at this point. Something has to be wrong with the flash itself.

Edited by sybersitizen - 16 December 2018 at 16:24
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phil Wood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 December 2018 at 18:55
Originally posted by sybersitizen sybersitizen wrote:

Something has to be wrong with the flash itself.


As I feared from the start - at least I now have a pretty good manual flash gun, before I started this thread it was totally useless!

Thanks for your help - all I need now is a repair manual!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote neilt3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 December 2018 at 20:45
Originally posted by Phil Wood Phil Wood wrote:

It's a recent acquisition and has never worked properly with the cameras I have tried it on. It may be faulty - or I may be faulty!   

According to Sony it does not support TTL mode in my cameras - https://www.sony.com.au/support/resources/en_AP/html/Compatibility/DSLR/Flash/konica/5600hs.html it is not compatible with my A77 or A900 in TTL mode (presumably the same incompatibility applies to the A58, but the compatibility chart predates its release).

This is, presumably, because the camera (A900) does not have a TTL mode - just ADI & P-TTL. The flash supports these apparently, but does not have an ADI or P-TTL setting in the menu. Back to the manuals!


The Minolta 5600HS/D is fully functional with the Sony a900 ( assuming nothings faulty !).
I have three Minolta 5600HS/D's , a few 3600HS/D's , the Minolta twin and ring flash controller and Sony twin flash , HVL-F58AM and HVL-F20AM .

All these flashes work as intended on my a900 , a700 , a580 , a100 , a37 and NEX 7 , both on camera and wirelessly .

When Sony took on the Minolta camera gear the 5600HS/D and 3600HS/D were rebranded as the HVL-F56AM & HVL-F36AM , the insides remained the same and were backward compatible with Minolta DSLR's 35mm SLR's and DiMage Bridge cameras as well as the Vectis range ( film and digital ).

The compatibility chart you refer to that says the 5600HS/D does not work in TTL mode with the a900 is correct . You'll also notice this flash doesn't work in TTL mode with any of the other listed cameras too .
That's because there all digital cameras , TTL is a metering method on film cameras .
TTL mode is when the light being reflected of the 35mm film is measured and when sufficient has been received the flash output is stopped .

This doesn't work with with the shiny sensors on DSLR's , so the two options are ADI flash control with "D" type lenses , those with a distance encoding chip in them .
First used in the film Dynax 7 , with the focused distance information from the lens , focal length , aperture and ISO etc , the camera works out how much light is needed , and that's what's given out .
Reflectivity of surfaces don't affect the exposure , but only works with direct flash , not bounce flash .

With digital cameras the camera uses a pre-flash TTL (P-TTL)method to calculate the required amount of light needed .
A little bit of flash is given out , and what returns back to the camera TTL is what's used to calculate how much main flash is given out for the exposure .

So this flash on the a900 does control the flash exposure TTL .

Which flash control mode you want , ADI , P-TTL and Manual as well as if it is hot shoe mounted or to be used wirelessly ( with a HVL-F20AM or HVL-F58AM as controller on the a900)** is set on the camera , not the flash .**

Things to set on the flash are such as frequency of the strobe rate (Hertz)if you're using that , and power output as a ratio such as 1:1 , 1:2 , 1:16 etc .
Useful if your shooting manually and want a bit of fill in flash or want to reduce output for close up and macro .
These are shown on the flash's LCD .

It might be helpful if you took a picture of the flash mounted on the camera with both the LCD's lit up so we can rule out it being a setting that's wrong .Just to be sure .

If you haven't already , reset the flash to the default settings , Sybercitizen has a manual on his website ;
   http://thesybersite.com/minolta/documents/5600HSD_Manual.pdf
and put the camera in auto rather than Aperture priority etc , and take a shot .
You've already cleaned the contacts on the camera and flash as already suggested ?

When the shot is underexposed , is the flash set to bounce or direct ?
If it's set up for bounce flash but the switch in the flash to tell it the head is tilted might not be working and it is still running in ADI mode .
Just another thought ......
see my photostream on flickr;
http://www.flickr.com/photos/neilt3/
C & C welcome.
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