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A99 wl flash delay

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Peekayoh View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Peekayoh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 January 2013 at 10:24
Photosopher, I'm kinda losing track here but..

The F20 stand alone in TTL or manual has no delay.
The F20 as trigger to F56 in wireless mode does have the delay in both TTL and manual.
It seems that the delay is not entirely down to calculation of exposure.

FEL can be set to "Toggle" or "Hold".
The pre-flash and exposure calculation takes place when you engage FEL so no flash delay.
 



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IanL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote IanL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 January 2013 at 11:11
Originally posted by Photosopher Photosopher wrote:

Originally posted by FarmerDave FarmerDave wrote:

FEL=NO wireless delay.


Sounds good... Can you confirm the parameters this applies to? Pre-Flash TTL? ADI?


ADI cannot be used with wireless. It only works for a pop-up flash or a shoe-mounted flash which is not pointed up to bounce.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote IanL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 January 2013 at 11:20
Originally posted by matthiaspaul matthiaspaul wrote:

... Example:

HVL-F60M mounted on SLT-A99 will allow ADI, whereas a HVL-F60M connected via ADP-MAA + OC-1100 / FA-CC1AM must not and should not allow for ADI (I cannot test this as I don't own a SLT-A99 or HVL-F60M).


This could be recognised by open circuits on ID1-3.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote matthiaspaul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 January 2013 at 14:20
Originally posted by IanL IanL wrote:

Originally posted by matthiaspaul matthiaspaul wrote:

... Example:

HVL-F60M mounted on SLT-A99 will allow ADI, whereas a HVL-F60M connected via ADP-MAA + OC-1100 / FA-CC1AM must not and should not allow for ADI (I cannot test this as I don't own a SLT-A99 or HVL-F60M).


This could be recognised by open circuits on ID1-3.

Yep, this would be a straight-forward logical choice - and probably the cheapest to implement.

But there are other possible kinds of "sense loops" which could be used for this purpose as well (f.e. there are multiple GND pins). At this stage, we just don't know for sure how Sony chosed to implement it.

Greetings,

Matthias
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Photosopher View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Photosopher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 January 2013 at 19:06
Originally posted by Peekayoh Peekayoh wrote:

Photosopher, I'm kinda losing track here but..

The F20 stand alone in TTL or manual has no delay.
The F20 as trigger to F56 in wireless mode does have the delay in both TTL and manual.
It seems that the delay is not entirely down to calculation of exposure.

FEL can be set to "Toggle" or "Hold".
The pre-flash and exposure calculation takes place when you engage FEL so no flash delay.


Thank you for the thorough report. It's so odd that FEL removes delay, even required for all manual everything. As if some latent automation is still present, like auto iso or something.

Hope someone here has the BatPhone for Sony firmware suggestion box. Dyxum early adopters are sure going above and beyond the call of duty performing a99 field tests for stills. The R&D was obviously spent on making video-togs happy.

Leave it to Dyxum to save the day... once again. You guys are awesome!
______

Should someone report workaround to Gary Friedman, SAR, AlphaClub, and AlphaStrobist?

Edited by Photosopher - 02 January 2013 at 19:09
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Post Options Post Options   Quote FarmerDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 01:34
I made such comment on Gary's blog (wireless delay video)and he checked it out and made the comment that indeed default FEL is in toggle so not just one shot. He is the one that point out FEL is unlocked by pressing same c button or by play (image review).
I also posted on dpreview but people over there didn't think much of this work around. There are very few diehard factory wireless fans but like Gary, I am one of them even though I have Elimchrome and Alienware strobes. I hate digging out the light/flash meter.
 



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Peekayoh View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Peekayoh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 11:02
Originally posted by Photosopher Photosopher wrote:

...... Thank you for the thorough report. It's so odd that FEL removes delay, even required for all manual everything. As if some latent automation is still present, like auto iso or something. .......
Photosopher, I'm probably guilty of being unclear. When you press the button to engage FEL, the pre flash triggers immediately and presumably does the flash strength calculation. The shutter is then just a dumb trigger for the flash and works as you would expect. I agree though that the behaviour in manual mode is distinctly odd and thinking about it, that's probably what you meant but I'll this as is just to be absolutely clear. Anyway, I think you'll be happy with the flash in this mode.

I know I've said it before but I don't like the flash on camera especially with this blasted adapter. The Pixel King triggers do not suffer from the excessive delay either in manual or TTL. Go figure!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Peekayoh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 14:40
BTW, I should have said the the manual seems to indicate that only the F20, F43, F58 and F60 are FEL compatible.

??
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kiklop Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 15:39
Originally posted by Peekayoh Peekayoh wrote:

Anyway, I think you'll be happy with the flash in this mode.
I stated when a99 spec came out that FEL is a great addition to Sony system (i use it often with my Nikon gear) and many will love it.
FEL is great to minimize "lazy eyes" that some people exhibit as well
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Post Options Post Options   Quote analytical Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 17:01
Originally posted by Peekayoh Peekayoh wrote:

BTW, I should have said the the manual seems to indicate that only the F20, F43, F58 and F60 are FEL compatible.

??
Which manual do you mean?
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analytical View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote analytical Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 17:17
Originally posted by Peekayoh Peekayoh wrote:

Photosopher, I'm kinda losing track here but..
The F20 as trigger to F56 in wireless mode does have the delay in both TTL and manual.
Me too.
Has someone tried any of there (wording on posts was not always clear to me.)    
On A99
the F20 as trigger to F58 in wireless mode
the F20 as trigger to F60 in wireless mode
the F58 as wireless trigger to any flash in wireless mode
the F60 as wireless trigger to any flash in wireless mode
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Peekayoh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 17:25
Originally posted by analytical analytical wrote:

Originally posted by Peekayoh Peekayoh wrote:

BTW, I should have said the the manual seems to indicate that only the F20, F43, F58 and F60 are FEL compatible.

??
Which manual do you mean?
a99 manual p122.
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analytical View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote analytical Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 17:49
Originally posted by Peekayoh Peekayoh wrote:

a99 manual p122.
Ahah! The A99 "instruction manual" I downloaded a while back from sony support only has 99 pages and barely mentions flash operation let alone wireless.

I see that an "alpha handbook" now also appears that contains more. I see the flash model list for wireless though it's on p116.   The p122 FEL Lock comments don't seem to be about wireless. In fact in the manual it doesn't seem clear whether FEL lock is supposed to work in wireless mode.


Edited by analytical - 03 January 2013 at 18:14
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analytical View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote analytical Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 January 2013 at 18:24
When posts on this thread have said "FEL" did they mean "FEL Lock?" The A99 Handbook p122 defines FEL as "Flash Exposure Level" and only discusses FEL as "FEL Lock" or "lock the FEL," not as a separate setting.   

So maybe FELL?   
              
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