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New camera A or E mount?

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Imaginations View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Imaginations Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: New camera A or E mount?
    Posted: 11 November 2018 at 21:03
Hi all,

It's been a long time since I posted here, but I have been reading and as we say in the Netherlands, I can't see the trees through the forest anymore with the many E mount choices and what will it gain me over an apha77II? I really need some help...

The story before the question. My current first camera is alpha 77 with sal70-400. If I go out and only want to take one camera and one lens, that's my go to combo. But if I go on a weekend trip or longer I always take 2 camera's with me, because I hate changing lenses all the time, especially outside. So my 2nd camera is alpha 700 with sal16-105. My third lens is the tamron 90mm.
I photograph animals, wild or in the zoo. I also like photographing landscapes.

My 700 broke down a few weeks ago after 11 years of use, so I am a bit sad about that, but it is also a great excuse to buy something new :)

So I'm looking for a new camera which will become my first camera and I will mostly use the 70-400 with that camera. I am looking for more AF speed & less noise (in the photos), more sharpness would be nice, but maybe that's more a lens problem...

I went to a photo event today and had a nice talk about E mount camera's at the sony booth, I always thought my next step would be 77II (maybe 77III?), but the future is clearly E mount. I really want to keep using my current lenses for the moment.

So the question: Which combo will give me the best results shooting wildlife, I'm talking everything from whalewatching, gamedrives, photography in hides, hiking in national parks, mammals, birds, reptiles etc ;)

Alpha 77II with SAL70-400G
A7 MARK II with adapter with SAL70-400G
A7R MARK II with adapter with SAL70-400G
A7 MARK III with adapter with SAL70-400G

From what I read the LA-EA4 will be the best choice as adapter?

Hope you guys can help me a bit with the choice I am about to make...
 



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Photosopher View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Photosopher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 November 2018 at 21:23
Originally posted by Imaginations Imaginations wrote:

...the future is clearly E mount.


The future is whatever you want it to be.

Originally posted by Imaginations Imaginations wrote:

I really want to keep using my current lenses for the moment.


a77II is hard to beat with the extra reach of APScrop. You may find the full frames come up short.
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pegelli View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pegelli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 November 2018 at 21:25
In my mind you're asking two key questions. The first is format (APS-C or FF) and the second mount (A or E) and I think you should answer them in that order.

If you want to stay APS-C the easiest is get an A77ii, put your 70-400 on it and use your A77 with the other 2 lenses. Going A6500 with an adapter doesn't make much sense imho, and neither the A6300 nor A6000 have IBIS.


If you want to go FF it's A99 (or A99ii), or an A7 series camera.
Shooting wildlife the A99ii has an edge, because of the wider field you probably need to crop more and on that camera an APS-C crop is still 18.6 MP while on an A99 its just 10.6 MP (slightly below your old A700).

Same would be for the A7 series, the A7R's have more crop room vs. the base 24 MP models.

For the SAL 70-400 a LA-EA3 will be fine, but the iii will give you much better AF with that combo vs. the ii series.

But for your other lenses you'll need an LA-EA4 to even have AF, but since there the AF is built in the adapter (and doesn't use the body AF) Also the AF module of the LA-EA4 isn't the latest state of the art, limited # of points and concentrated in the center. It works fine for me, but for my shooting AF speed and flexibility is not needed and from your story I get that you rely more on AF than I do.



Mind the bandwidth of others, don't link pictures larger then 1024 wide or 960 pix high, see here
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Swede101 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 November 2018 at 22:15
Well, most of us want to simplify our lives. Hence there are so many voices to "simplify" even our camera world by having one solution only - i.e. dump everything outside the mirrorless cameras. Including a few, but not all, Sony representatives.

The succes of mirrorless cameras, particularily Sony's, is really huge. The old technology DSLR cameras with a lot of moving bits and pieces will certainly shrink its market shares.
But!
Don't count out the SLT cameras! These have NO mechanical moving bits (except the shutter, for now, but expect to see, sooner or later, a new A-mount body with full electronic curtain shutter in addition to the mechanical one). The important thing to understand is what will be possible with future technology, and to know that the SLT cameras are NOT DSLRs. They are actually mirrorless cameras! Albeit "Mirrorless cameras with mirrors", in the usual Sony brilliant-crazy way. :-)

Hence, consider that EVERY improvement of the mirrorless technology and sensors, can be DIRECTLY put into coming SLT cameras. The more the mirrorless technology is developed, the more powerfull future SLT cameras can be developed.

Pure mirrorless cameras of course have the advantage that the AF "spread" is less as it has not BF/FF-problems, but the DSLR and SLT cameras have the advantage to always "get the shot", while pure mirrorless cameras occasionally are "confused" and "don't know what to do".

What I am saying is that the SLT concept is not dead, it has a huge future potential - it just was BEFORE ITS TIME when launched.


Finally to your question :-)

What would be the best for you to do today?

Since I have tested some of the combinations you are considering, I can say that for photographing quickly moving objects, A77 II with SAL70-400G will give you SUPERIOR AF above all the three E-mount cameras with LA-EA4. I have used Sony A77, own the A77 II and have also used the A99 II. All of these will give you better AF than any E-mount camera with LA-EA4.

A77 II shows notably better AF than A77, which I am sure you will appreciate. The A99 II will, not surpricingly, give you even better AF and significantly less noise, both because it is a newer sensor and it is FF. You will also appreciate its 42 Mp sensor e.g. for landscapes.

I'll add that the A99 II is the dream camera FOR ME. :-)



Edited by Swede101 - 11 November 2018 at 22:22
Gunnar

A77 II; A550; D7D w VC-7D; D7; 500si Super w DB (Unused); NEX-3
20/2,8; 50/1,7 Old; 50/1,8; 28-80 (Unused); 28-80 D; 28-105 RS; 135/2,8; 500/8 Reflex; Tamron 90/2,8 Macro 1:1 (V2); 5600HS(D)
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Swede101 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 November 2018 at 22:31
In addition, if you really want to move over to E-mount and get AF in the same neighbourhood as your current combination, forget using adapted A-mount lenses, you need native E-mount lenses. Also forget A7R II for quickly moving objects (otherwise it will still produce fantastic images). Best for moving objects of course is A9, particularily in combination with a native Dual AF motor lens.

Gunnar

A77 II; A550; D7D w VC-7D; D7; 500si Super w DB (Unused); NEX-3
20/2,8; 50/1,7 Old; 50/1,8; 28-80 (Unused); 28-80 D; 28-105 RS; 135/2,8; 500/8 Reflex; Tamron 90/2,8 Macro 1:1 (V2); 5600HS(D)
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Aavo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 November 2018 at 06:00
My 6-years experiens for now is, that if you decide to go with e-mount, you probably find too, that e-mount is great (mostly) with e-mount lenses.
If you decide to go with aps-c, then a6500 or coming newer models with IBIS are ok. Otherwise you don't have stabilisation for your a-mount lenses and lot of nice e-mount lenses have no IS.
a6500 & some nice e-mount lenses. Be fond of photography - this is the way to alleviate stress
 



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Post Options Post Options   Quote ABDurbs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 November 2018 at 11:18
Originally posted by Imaginations Imaginations wrote:

Hi all,

I photograph animals, wild or in the zoo. I also like photographing landscapes.



As has already been mentioned, to get the best out of E mount you should use E mount lenses without an adapter. With that in mind, consider the cost of moving to E mount versus the cost of staying with A mount - an A77ii or A99ii (99) body. If you are happy with the additional cost of starting in a new mount, then I would recommend the move to E Mount (mirrorless) as it is the future. You could of course also look at the 2nd hand market in both mounts.

Personally I would prefer my A77ii for wildlife, rather than A7iii, A7Rii, or A7ii with an adapter. But that's just me

Examples:

Adapter $348
A7iii   $1998
A77ii   $1198

Sorry I have only US$ as a reference
Regards
Allan
A99 + VG, A77ii + VG, 70-400G, Zeiss 85mm f1.7, CZ16-80, Tamron 70-200 USD Tamron 24-70 USD, HVL-43AM, Godox TT685S & X1T-S, Minolta 8000i, Minolta 50mm f1.7
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Miranda F View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Miranda F Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 November 2018 at 11:54
My stock answer when anyone asks about a camera/lens combo for wildlife shooting, is to pick the best lens they can afford and then the cheapest camera that will do justice to it. In photography, glass usually trumps metal!
If you already have a lens you're happy with and that's A-mount, then stick with A-mount for this. From all accounts the A77ii is better than the i, so maybe trade one for the other as your prime camera?

If your second camera gets used for other lenses, as you suggest, and these will be much shorter focal length, then I would defintiely consider an E-mount FF camera for that, if there's a single affordable FE lens that will do the job.

To me, the combination of a decent A-mount APS-C camera and an E-mount with small lenses makes a lot of sense, but of coruse it will depend on what you want.
Miranda F & Sensorex, Sony A58, Nex-6, Dynax 4, 5, 60, 500si/600si/700si/800si, various Sony & Minolta lenses, several Tamrons, lots of MF primes and *far* too many old film cameras . . .
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Aavo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 November 2018 at 12:45
Originally posted by Miranda F Miranda F wrote:

To me, the combination of a decent A-mount APS-C camera and an E-mount with small lenses makes a lot of sense, but of coruse it will depend on what you want.

This is good solution!
a6500 & some nice e-mount lenses. Be fond of photography - this is the way to alleviate stress
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Post Options Post Options   Quote skm.sa100 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 November 2018 at 13:39
Pretty much everything has already been said.
I'll add one point: A mount glass is now extremely affordable on the used market. Sony will continue to support A mount into the future a good bit.
To my way of thinking, sticking to A mount, especially the SLTs is the way to go.
More Dyxumer, less photographer.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote adhox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 November 2018 at 22:45
From what you've said, I would opt for a nicely priced A77ii to use with your 70-400. The APS-C crop will give you better value at the long end for your wildlife images and you'll appreciate the improvements over your a77 & a700. It will also pay nicely with your 16-105.

The A99ii is another step up, but unless you use the crop mode you'd lose the effective telephoto reach that you're used to and your 16-105 will vignette badly.

If you go E-mount, you might want two adapters to keep using your lenses - the 70-400 will autofocus more quickly using the LA-AE3, but the 16-105 will only autofocus with the LA-AE4. As others have noted, if you buy an A7(x) or A6x00, you will want to consider buying native lenses, which are considerably more expensive than the very affordable A-mount lenses that are available.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Aavo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 November 2018 at 10:57
Originally posted by Atom Ant Oz Atom Ant Oz wrote:

As others have noted, if you buy an A7(x) or A6x00, you will want to consider buying native lenses, which are considerably more expensive than the very affordable A-mount lenses that are available.

E-mount aps-c is not considerably more expensive, if not to speak about great DT lenses alike 35/1,8, 50/1,8 and 85/2,8. Here Sigma has made trio 19/30/60mm f2,8 - as good as named DT lenses and more flexible because of covering 28-90mm full frame, including note, that sigma 60/2,8 has great sharpness from f2,8 and can be easily used with lot of croping, adequate to 150mm full frame and even more.

The same about zooms. 18-135/3,5-5,6 OSS and 18-105/4 G OSS PZ are great lenses with lovely reach easly up to 200mm full frame.

Wider primes with MF are nearly hyper focal, so there are some cheaper solutions too, incl. Samyang/Rokinon 12/2.

So, e-mount aps-c differs from full frame - lenses can be acceptable, as considerably cheaper compared to e-mount full frame.

And more compact and lightweight, if there is interest too - jacketable and beltbags friendly.
a6500 & some nice e-mount lenses. Be fond of photography - this is the way to alleviate stress
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Aavo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 November 2018 at 11:02
Sony e-mount trio 20/2.8, 35/1,8 OSS and 50/1,8 OSS can be ok too.
a6500 & some nice e-mount lenses. Be fond of photography - this is the way to alleviate stress
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Imaginations Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 November 2018 at 11:02
Thanks all for your replies, I really appreciate it! You have given me lots to think about and some new ideas!

I should have said, mirrorless looks like the future instead of clearly is, that was my dissapointment speaking after the photo event I went to. The Sony booth was all mirrorless and some cybershots, no 99II of 77II. I really wanted to see them both and play with them a bit. To me it came across like they abandonned the A mount.

As for FF or APS-C, that wil definatly have a big influence in my choice. I've been shooting APS-C with 400mm lenses for 11 years, so I am really used to it. And I sometimes do feel I am still lacking focal length The 6000 series is definatly not an option, I need IBIS since I shoot handheld most of the time.

AF speed is also important. I really love my A77, but it frustrates me sometimes when I miss a shot because it is not fast enough. It's has no problem with relativly slow moving animals like big whales, but speedy dolphins are a challenge! And I don't mind a challenge now and again, but when I miss a jumpshot I am a bit bummed.

I am really glad to read that you all think that the SLT's have a future, beacuse if there will be a 77III that would 100% be my first choice! I really like the specs on the 77II, I know it will be an improvement on my 77, but the tech is 4 years old, the firmware is also 4 years old. I can't buy a new camera every year, so I have to think long term. If I buy it now I would like to use it for at least 5 years.

The 7 series with adapter and A mount lens would be a temporary solution. I get that E lenses will ofcourse get better results, but E mount is very expensive, so I would have to take it step by step.

So my new train of thought: buy a 2nd hand SLT to replace my 700. I am thinking A68. It looks to me like a dressed down A77II, I could work with that for a little while. I could continue saving up money and just see where the market goes. If Sony will release another SLT (fingers crossed), if E mount lenses will get cheaper versions (sigma, tamron)

I also really like the idea of sticking with A mount for the wildlife and E mount with a small zoomlens for landscapes (and maybe even macro)
Maybe black friday will bring some awesome deals that could sway me to go that way

Thanks again all, this really helped me a lot!
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