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Project 21x9 for 2021

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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Project 21x9 for 2021
    Posted: 12 December 2020 at 11:22
Project 21x9 for 2021
Make one 21:9 format image per week for a year. Open topic. Any gear.

This is one for landscapers, cityscapers, and street shooters ... and others?

My original idea for this was when I was about to get the Fujifilm 14mm f2.8 (effective 21mm) and make a commitment to produce one decent 21mm shot each week through 2021.  21 being the theme.  And as a terrible landscape shooter this would really challenge me. But any lens can work this.

I used to be a keen movie fan and still love the super duper widescreen format, 16:9 doesn't look epic enough to me ... then I drifted into a wiki deep dive into 16:9 and the wider formats.  Note that cinema 21:9 isn't exactly 21x9.
- various ultra-wide - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrawide_formats 
- 21:9 specifically - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/21:9_aspect_ratio

A portrait shooter challenge too ... I've often paused a movie frame when they have focused in on one character as a portrait and looked at how well they have framed one person in 21:9 aspect.  It is a format we are familiar with in movies but not so much as stills.  This is often done with a lot of 'proper bokeh' (background blur that you can still understand the background). 

How to compose in 21:9 ... sadly, one key trick the mirrorless camera makers have all missed is the option to dial-in your own aspect ratio for stills.  And in mirrorless this would be a very simple addition to include.  But we have 16:9 frame to the rescue.  If your camera can show you 16:9 format and you add the 'thirds grid' then 21:9 is the centre row plus about 60% of the top and half of the bottom sectors.  You are (by eye) binning the upper and lower 40% of the top and bottom row you see - which you then need to crop later when editing.  I've tried this in the field and it is easy to compose with a gridded 16:9 as a reference frame knowing you are only getting about half the top and bottom rows.  This isn't exact but works as a very good approximation in the field. 

Some example web sized file sizes 
- 21:9 (exact, aka 7:3, 2.33:1) = 700 x 300 pixels
- 21:9 (cinema shooting is 64:27, 2.37:1) = 711 x 300 pixels
pretty similar but I'd aim for 711x300 myself.

As a comparison 16:9 would be 711x400 pixels. So, with reference to the 16:9 frame and the thirds grids each row in your viewfinder is like 133 pixels of the web sized image. And you only want to include 83/133ths (62%) of the top and bottom bits. I'd appreciate someone checking my maths there.

I'm probably going to combine this with the Project 250 as one of my once a week shots.

Anyone tried to shoot a wider format than 16:9 stills?
I can still remember how that music used to make me smile
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pegelli View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pegelli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2020 at 20:40
That's an innovative idea dCap, I'll give it a try and we'll see how far I get. Certainly doing a 365 or even your 250 idea is too daunting for me given all the other stuff I do but this is probably manageble. I'll start off with my OM Zuiko 21/3.5 which I used for the latest oktoberfest and quite liked. Corners are so-so on close inspection but probably cropping to 21x9 will cure that problem to a large extent.

Other WA's I could use (when I get tired of the 21 mm) is a 12 mm and a 17 mm for going wider and a 24 mm,35 mm and much longer if I want to go tighter.

And to show I sometimes crop even tighter here's a 21:6.3 crop I did for week 50 this year (but it ended up in the outtakes)



Should we move this thread to themed views so everybody can add their weekly letterbox crop pictures underneath?

And a last question, are you going to do this with the RX100 or will you get a "real" sony camera for these challenges
You can see the April Foolishness 2021 exhibition here Another great show of the talent we have on Dyxum
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phil Wood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2020 at 23:08
It's an interesting idea - here's an attempt at 21:9 (why is that not 7:3?) cropped from a Week 50 shot.


Sony A99ii + Minolta AF 50mm f3.5

Edited by Phil Wood - 12 December 2020 at 23:14
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pegelli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2020 at 08:50
Here's another old shot that worked well with a 7,11 x 3 crop

The old town of Wroclaw over the river

NEX6 + E16-50PZ

I think such a narrow crop ratio works well for landscapes and architecture
You can see the April Foolishness 2021 exhibition here Another great show of the talent we have on Dyxum
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pegelli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2020 at 13:06
From today, taken specifically with this idea in mind

Castle Hallehof


A7ii + Yashica DSB 50/1.9, full width, only cropped top/bottom

Btw, I found the best way for me to compose/frame the shot is to put the aspect ratio at 16:9 and show the 6 x 4 square grid on the screen/viewfinder.

Then 7,11 x 3 is three of the 4 rows of squares. You either eyeball leaving out half a square at the top and bottom, or just use the top 3 or bottom 3 rows entirely which is even a mild "shift lens effect" to avoid perspective distortion you normally get when pointing the camera slightly up or down.
You can see the April Foolishness 2021 exhibition here Another great show of the talent we have on Dyxum
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 December 2020 at 13:19
Really good to see some examples posted (I needed an image host to post a box showing composition tricks, but tried with words).

The corn fields (?) from @peg look like a classic movie intro, even though it is 50mm rather than a wide (but that is only really given away by lack of foreground focus thanks to 50mm compression I guess). I can imagine cityscapes with a telephoto working too, so not just the fodder of wides.

The other three images all show how scenes can work well in this ultra wide format. I'm thinking night time shots of city/town shops and alley ways as well as landscapes and even interiors (if we're ever allowed indoors next year).

Happy for the thread to move to where you say, or let me know if you want a briefer introduction wording for a new thread for 2021. My preference would be a once a week entry per person and also for it to be new shots, but I can imagine landscapers might also have some shots in the archive that fit the idea.

As for my camera - yes, I would like to do this with something bigger than my pocket RX100 (fun though it is). Especially as I'm intending to go specifically to 1-2 places each week to shoot this (local walks). It is also why a6400/10-18f4 is one of my contenders for my move to Sony (other being A7II/28f2 which is cheaper and messing with my head!).
I can still remember how that music used to make me smile
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 December 2020 at 21:55
I've just re-checked my maths coming from a different direction. Using actual pixels that an A7 II or A7 R II would capture (according to Sony spec sheet).

A7 II raw file is gonna be 6000 x 4000 pixels (3:2)
16:9 will give you a 6000 x 3376 jpg (as a guide)
64:27 needs to be 6000 x 2531 from your RAW

64:27 is the true ratio of cinemascope 21:9
(which is 21.33333`:9 coming from 4^3:3^3)
21:9 is clearly easier to say than " 21 and a 1/3 : 9 "

Suggested forum size of the image is 960 x 405
This is exactly 64:27 or 1:2.370`
It also allows those who like adding frames/borders some extra space and still have the image viewable

A7 R II
3:2 = 7952 x 5304 (RAW)
16:9 = 7952 x 4472 (JPG as a guide)
cinemascope 21:9 = 7952 x 3355

In terms of in the EVF or on the LCD framing guides. Either/or:
- frame in 3:2, turn on third grid lines and keep 45%, of the top and bottom rows
- frame in 16:9, turn on thirds grid lines and keep 62% of the top and bottom rows
neither of those are ideal, I was hoping for a simpler 50% but it isn't so

For other older/newer sensors, just divide your width by 64 and multiply by 27.
I can still remember how that music used to make me smile
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Post Options Post Options   Quote QuietOC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 December 2020 at 22:47
I bought a "21:9" monitor back 2016. It was a 64:27. It was quite nice for watching movies that had a similar format, though it required some extra software to get that working correctly.

I did enjoy that format for photography. I've used it for past challenges here. I need to add it back in as custom aspect ratio in Capture One. I no longer have the monitor. I opted for a boring 16:9 display again.

Edited by QuietOC - 17 December 2020 at 22:58
Sony A7RIV NEX-5T HVL-F45RM LA-EA5 Metabones-IV Sigma MC-11 Yongnuo EF-E II TLT ROKR MD-NEX KR-NEX DA-NEX
Minolta Maxxum 600si
Pentax Q7 5-15 15-45/2.8 8.5/1.9 11.5/9 AF-P/Q
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 December 2020 at 00:22
the 21:9 monitor (and I think there are more extreme versions too) are along the same lines of the dual screen that used to be the fashion when screens were expensive and smaller. They're a relative bargain now. I have 'some kind of new widescreen' on my wish list.

This is another benefit of the video craze/fad - these ultrawides are handy for the video editors and that means stills shooters benefit from more choice, and lower prices, too. Just like the video abilities of our stills cameras that make the stills stuff more efficient and faster.
I can still remember how that music used to make me smile
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 December 2020 at 10:39
If someone wants to run this as a themed thread from 01-Jan onwards then please go ahead and do that - would be real fun to see this as a year long 'once a week' post from people who like the 21:9 idea. 21:9 is what the format is referred to as (or cinemascope) even though it is really 64:27 that doesn't have '21' in it and doesn't match the year 2021. and 21.33333333333333333`:9 is a bit of a mouthful and only appeases the pedants.

(if not, then I'll post it first full week of Jan)

I'll not have my A7 II until first full week of Jan, maybe the week after, and other than today am pretty much off-line until then developing something else.

My preference would be to make this a 'new images only' thing. And also a once a week gig. I'm sure there are 16:9 or wider images in yer archives that might work well to launch the thread off. Would be smart if I find an image host too huh (flickr probably)!

If someone wants to set other/different rules then go ahead - I'm rather forum rusty and not sure how things get ported/started over in the theme thread area.

Good to see there is some interest in this. On a personal note I'm aiming to shoot/edit one '21:9' (it will be true 64:27 format) image per week as I'd like to convert from being a poor landscaper today to something better by this time next year. But the format would also work for street shots and other topics too.

Edited by dCap - 21 December 2020 at 11:05
I can still remember how that music used to make me smile
- Don McLean
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Howard_S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 December 2020 at 11:36
I just posted a photo of a nearby church using 64:27 aspect ratio. The source is 6000x2532, i.e. full width as recorded.


Holy Trinity Headington Quarry
Howard Stanbury Instagram | Flickr | Web
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 December 2020 at 14:05
@Howard - it works well - it looks just like a normal/natural perspective scene - glad it doesn't look toooooo stretched.

Viewed the flickr version on my laptop and it fills my 16:9 laptop screen (1080p) with the tabs/address/bookmarks/PHOTO/taskbar perfectly. No vertical/horizontal scrolls too.
I can still remember how that music used to make me smile
- Don McLean
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pegelli Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 December 2020 at 14:58
I've now made 7,11 x 3 a "standard" cropping option in my Lightroom setup.

It works well for a lot of shots, see here for one posted in the "Yachts....." thread
You can see the April Foolishness 2021 exhibition here Another great show of the talent we have on Dyxum
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 December 2020 at 15:06
Originally posted by pegelli pegelli wrote:

I've now made 7,11 x 3 a "standard" cropping option in my Lightroom setup.

It works well for a lot of shots, see here for one posted in the "Yachts....." thread


I thought: mmm, 21x9 would be nice ... when I saw these two from you
- Ter Elst in Duffel, Belgium
https://www.dyxum.com/dforum/castles-old-buildings-2_topic101175_post1637074.html#1637074
- The Hague, Netherlands
https://www.dyxum.com/dforum/cityscapes-2_topic133571_post1637048.html#1637048

am really looking forward to trying this through 2021
I can still remember how that music used to make me smile
- Don McLean
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