FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Sony Dilemma

Page  123>
Author
ABDurbs View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 27 October 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Durban
Status: Offline
Posts: 1016
Post Options Post Options   Quote ABDurbs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Sony Dilemma
    Posted: 20 August 2018 at 10:58
Last week I attended a Fujifilm launch and workshop session at my local dealer in Durban, South Africa. For a while now I have been seriously considering moving to mirrorless so thought it would be interesting to do a comparison and get some hands on experience with a mirrorless system.

At the launch the CEO (Japanese) for Fujifilm South Africa and 4 other top guys from Fujifilm attended. All their products were on display for us to view and "play" with. Over the next 2 days their ambassador hosted some practical workshops. They also launched a "Hire To Buy Scheme" and will have a few loan models available. I had never even considered Fujifilm before.

Sony pulled out of South Africa some time ago and only recently have they once again entered the South African market, through the local Nikon agency. There are only a limited number of dealers selling Sony (none in Durban) and only the E mount range. There is limited stock and most will have to be ordered from the Agents through the dealer. There are limited accessories and NO A mount options of any kind available, and because Sony is being imported/sold through the Nikon agent, prices are ridiculous.

I was extremely impressed with Fujifilm equipment. Build is solid, lens selection very good and image quality excellent. Back up service is also excellent and a bonus that they are just up the road from me.

As I will be changing mounts regardless of which brand I choose, if you were in my shoes (considering what I said above about Sony), would you also be considering mirrorless options like Fujifilm/Olympus, rather than sticking with Sony? I have always been fiercely pro Sony, but......

I have no specific genre but I do lean more toward wildlife so my initial plan would be to change my A77ii for mirrorless and keep my A99 setup for now.
Regards
Allan
A99 + VG, A77ii + VG, 70-400G, Zeiss 85mm f1.7, CZ16-80, Tamron 70-200 USD Tamron 24-70 USD, HVL-43AM, Godox TT685S & X1T-S, Minolta 8000i, Minolta 50mm f1.7
 



Back to Top
Paul07 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 09 March 2006
Country: Belgium
Status: Offline
Posts: 2159
Post Options Post Options   Quote Paul07 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 11:18
I see you use an A99 now. I don't think Fuji has anything like that in mirrorless. Sony does: the A9.

Having little local support can be a real issue, depending on your needs of course. You looked into the Fuji alternative and seem to be pleased with you found there, so I assume you don't really need the A9's full frame performance.
In that case, I would make the switch I think. I have heard good things about Fuji, especially also their lenses.

α7RIII 24-70CZ 70-200G 200-600G SY35/2.8 SY45/1.8 85/1.8 ~~~ RX10 IV ~~~ Nex-5 16-70/4 ~~~ α100 50/1.4 24-105 ~~~ HX60V
Back to Top
ABDurbs View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 27 October 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Durban
Status: Offline
Posts: 1016
Post Options Post Options   Quote ABDurbs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 11:30
Hi Paul

Thanks for your reply. I use an A77ii and an A99, and would move to an A9 in a heartbeat, but I need a place to live

We can't even buy 3rd party flashes for Sony in this country, that's how bad the support is.
Regards
Allan
A99 + VG, A77ii + VG, 70-400G, Zeiss 85mm f1.7, CZ16-80, Tamron 70-200 USD Tamron 24-70 USD, HVL-43AM, Godox TT685S & X1T-S, Minolta 8000i, Minolta 50mm f1.7
Back to Top
nandbytes View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 09 January 2014
Country: United Kingdom
Location: London
Status: Offline
Posts: 3372
Post Options Post Options   Quote nandbytes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 11:54
Lack of support can certainly be a problem...

Here's my run down of pro-cons

Fuji:
+ Nice selection of APS-C lenses
+ Uses sony APS-C sensors
+ excellent EVF
+ Good customer support. (In UK i have heard many stories of 1 day turnaround times!)
- xtrans causes loss of details and especially an issue for landscapes
- their RAW files are hard to PP
- AF while it has improved is still not as good as others
- some keys prime lenses are slow to AF. The 56mm/1.2 is god awful slow. Their 23mm1.4 is slow also. There are few others that are slow.
- no FF option

Sony:
+ FF option
+ great FF and APS-C sensors
+ great FF lenses
+ 3rd parties jumping in on sony e-mount (tamron, sigma, tokina, zeiss etc)
+ excellent EVF
+ class leading AF and eye-AF
+ good battery life with latest gen FF bodies
+ fast focussing lenses
- rubbish APS-C lenses
- expensive lenses
- rubbish customer support
- lack of time lapse feature
- heavy to some extent (though i don't think is an issue for you)
- rubbish weather sealing

m43:
+ small, rugged and good IQ
+ class leading IBIS
+ great lenses
- 4:3 aspect ratio
- small sensor and hence less DoF control
- best sensors are always held back for flagship bodies that are as big as Sony FF options
- flagships cost as much as sony FF

Basically choose which format you'd like to shoot. If you are ok with APS-C only, go with Fuji. for FF there is only one option but Nikon and canon will release their options soon so might be worth waiting. For m43 there is only two options and both are excellent.

Edited by nandbytes - 20 August 2018 at 11:57
my flickr
A1, G5xii, DJI Air2s
Back to Top
owenn01 View Drop Down
Alpha Eyes group
Alpha Eyes group

Joined: 20 May 2008
Country: United Kingdom
Location: Kent
Status: Offline
Posts: 11577
Post Options Post Options   Quote owenn01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 11:57
Hi Allan,

Well, ultimately it would be your call but I think brand loyalty is something to admire but that has to only go so far; if the 'system' meets your expectations in terms of performance but falls very short in terms of on-going support and availability (and reassurance that you can get something fixed quickly locally?) then I would also start to seriously consider a move.

From what I've seen and heard people are very happy with their move to Fuji; there's a few Members at the local Camera Club that have done it plus we've had a few Pro's visit that have also mentioned they've changed systems (from a variety of sources) to the Fuji one and they've been very happy - but I guess it's the local support that is key for you in your choice (I don't believe there is a 'bad' camera out there now really; just one's that you can't get on with...)?

Good luck and something of a dilemma I suspect!

Best regards, Neil.
My Mantra: "Comment on other's work as you would wish to have yours commented upon". Go on - it's fun!
Back to Top
ABDurbs View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 27 October 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Durban
Status: Offline
Posts: 1016
Post Options Post Options   Quote ABDurbs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 12:14
Hi

Thanks Neil and nandytes,

I would be extremely happy to stick with Sony, but the frustration of no support is very disheartening. The Sony Alpha mount base in SA is dwindling fast so it's almost a case of get out of Dodge whilst I can still get something for my gear.

Judging from what nandbytes says about focus speeds etc, I fear I need to do further research
Regards
Allan
A99 + VG, A77ii + VG, 70-400G, Zeiss 85mm f1.7, CZ16-80, Tamron 70-200 USD Tamron 24-70 USD, HVL-43AM, Godox TT685S & X1T-S, Minolta 8000i, Minolta 50mm f1.7
 



Back to Top
TheEmrys View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 18 August 2012
Country: United States
Location: Northern CO
Status: Offline
Posts: 2103
Post Options Post Options   Quote TheEmrys Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 12:42
I went with Fuji for a while, and I am back with Sony. I had the XT-2, which is a fabulous body. I also had the 16-55/2.8, 23/1.4, 23/2, 56/1.2, 18-135, 55-200, and the 100-400. I even rented the 10-24. They just don't have any bad lenses.

Jpeg shooting is amazing. So is the film emulation. For RAWs, Adobe used to be a poor choice. However, there is a software converter that takes the RAW file, converts it to DNG, and then the Fuji files are a joy to use. I will see if I can find the name of that program because it made a big difference.

The 23/2 is a good lens, but the 23/1.4 is excellent. The 23/1.4 and 56/1.2 are a great combo. The 18-135 is one of the best superzooms I have used at f/8. I would personally skip the 16-55/2.8, not because it isn't good, but it is just very, very overpriced. It is great wide open.

But all that being said, I am back with Sony. The Tamron 28-75/2.8 was a big reason for that. It is excellent. And it supplants a lot of my old prime use. I still love the Minolta 100/2. If Fuji came out with a 66/1.4 or even a 70/1.4, I would possibly have stayed. But the move has been towards all high end lenses (200/2, 33/1) and if I need that speed, full frame is really the better option.
a7II, a6000 - Sony 28/2, 21mm converter, 55/1.8, 16-70/4, Minolta 28-135, 100/2, 80-200 HS G, Minolta 100-300 APO D,MD 35-70/3.5, MC 50/1.4
Back to Top
ABDurbs View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 27 October 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Durban
Status: Offline
Posts: 1016
Post Options Post Options   Quote ABDurbs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 13:13
Hi Emrys

Thanks for your reply. If Sony had decent support here I wouldn't even be contemplating changing, but they don't so if I am going to go mirrorless then I have to explore my options and so far Fujifilm is top of that list. Your info has been very helpful indeed especially the issue with RAW. I use Photoshop CC and having to convert to DNG is just another process I can do without. Will explore further.

OK just checked. It seems Photoshop CC does support Fujifilm XT-2 and X-H1

Edited by ABDurbs - 20 August 2018 at 13:22
Regards
Allan
A99 + VG, A77ii + VG, 70-400G, Zeiss 85mm f1.7, CZ16-80, Tamron 70-200 USD Tamron 24-70 USD, HVL-43AM, Godox TT685S & X1T-S, Minolta 8000i, Minolta 50mm f1.7
Back to Top
waldo_posth View Drop Down
Alpha Eyes group
Alpha Eyes group

Joined: 01 August 2012
Country: Germany
Location: Potsdam
Status: Offline
Posts: 6267
Post Options Post Options   Quote waldo_posth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 13:14
Since I used an X-Trans sensor only for a very limited time I am not an expert on Fujifilm cameras. But I liked the color fidelity of the images (which is, of course, a subjective measure). In the end I decided for a Sigma body with a FOVEON sensor as a backup camera that can provide "different" colors (and "different" B/W images as well).

The RAW-converter problem for the X-Trans sensors is mainly an Adobe problem. There are converters which do a better job (Iridient, for example).

Your style of photography also plays an important role. Do you shoot moving objects? The A77ii plus the 70400G-lens point to that. I assume that a Sony A6500 with a native E-mount telezoom lens (e.g., 100-400mm) would be on par with your combo as AF is concerned. Would a Fujifilm combo be on par as well?

That the Nikon dealer imports the Sony gear sounds like a joke, though. It's hard to imagine that you can buy Sony gear at a competitive price given the fact that Nikon is introducing its own mirrorless system.

Mirrorlessness had been the promise to create smaller, lighter cameras. Only the MFT standard has delivered on that promise so far (the size and weight of of the Sony GM FE-mount lenses exceeds that of the corresponding A-mount lenses). If beauty and compactness would be my primary criterion to select a camera body I would certainly opt for an Olympus Pen F.

Sorry, if my comments aren't really helpful.
"Stare, pry, listen, eavesdrop. Die knowing something. You are not here long." (Walker Evans)   http://www.flickr.com/photos/waldo_posth/
Back to Top
ABDurbs View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 27 October 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Durban
Status: Offline
Posts: 1016
Post Options Post Options   Quote ABDurbs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 13:29
Hi Waldo

Thanks for your reply and your comments are helpfull. Yes Nikon supplying Sony is a joke and they are definitely not going to push Sony with their new mirrorless system coming out soon. I will not be going to Sony mirrorless regardless, as there is just no Sony support here. If I go mirrorless then it will be with another brand that is well supported here, or I will just have to stick with my A mount until it turns to dust

I will be looking at Olympus Pen soon.
Regards
Allan
A99 + VG, A77ii + VG, 70-400G, Zeiss 85mm f1.7, CZ16-80, Tamron 70-200 USD Tamron 24-70 USD, HVL-43AM, Godox TT685S & X1T-S, Minolta 8000i, Minolta 50mm f1.7
Back to Top
C_N_RED_AGAIN View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 05 July 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Posts: 1368
Post Options Post Options   Quote C_N_RED_AGAIN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 13:41
Iíve seen the stuff you shoot. Iíd stick with Sony. Thier autofocus especially in e mount is far superior. Sony e mount has been growing rapidly. Give it a little time. Iím guessing they will have a presence in South Africa soon.
Back to Top
Aavo View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 03 April 2013
Country: Estonia
Location: Tallinn
Status: Offline
Posts: 5401
Post Options Post Options   Quote Aavo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 13:48
I think Sony aps-c e-mount is not for greatest attemt and surely not for pro work, so e-mount lenses can have step lower level quality too. But if to think, what there are few great aps-c lenses available and some FE lenses are small enougt too, then for everyday use e-mount aps-c is nicely covered.
I have tried many aps-c lenses and at the moment 4 lenses are for my need enough good, including great Sony 24/1,8Z.
Just for note - my other lenses are Sony 20/2.8, Sigma 60/2,8 and Sony 18-135/3,5-5,6 OSS. There is lot of quality for me.
a6500 & some nice e-mount af lenses 20/24/56/17-70/18-135 mm
Back to Top
ABDurbs View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 27 October 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Durban
Status: Offline
Posts: 1016
Post Options Post Options   Quote ABDurbs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 13:53
Thanks Aavo and CN Red Again, but Sony E mount is my last option as there is little to no support here is South Africa, and it is just going to get worse with the Sony agents (Nikon) launching their own mirrorless system soon.
Regards
Allan
A99 + VG, A77ii + VG, 70-400G, Zeiss 85mm f1.7, CZ16-80, Tamron 70-200 USD Tamron 24-70 USD, HVL-43AM, Godox TT685S & X1T-S, Minolta 8000i, Minolta 50mm f1.7
Back to Top
TheEmrys View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 18 August 2012
Country: United States
Location: Northern CO
Status: Offline
Posts: 2103
Post Options Post Options   Quote TheEmrys Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2018 at 13:54
Its Irident X-Transormer. And it is very quick and easy. It is an extra step, but well worth it. And I believe it is still free/in beta.

But, don't get me wrong:I am back with Sony because I believe that the system is going to be less costly than Fuji's. Tamron has a real winner with the updated 28-75/2.8. If they add a 35/1.8, and perhaps a 70-200, it will be stellar.

And please know, I came back to am a7II. An a7III would be an amazing body to build around. And Sony's flash system has gotten excellent. Fuji's is really a joke. Terrible.
a7II, a6000 - Sony 28/2, 21mm converter, 55/1.8, 16-70/4, Minolta 28-135, 100/2, 80-200 HS G, Minolta 100-300 APO D,MD 35-70/3.5, MC 50/1.4
Back to Top
Dyxum main page >  Forum Home > Equipment forums > Camera Talk > Other camera systems Page  123>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.066 seconds.

Monitor calibration strip

Dyxum.com - Home of the alpha system photographer

In memory of Cameron Hill - brettania

Feel free to contact us if needed.