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Sony RX-100 - III or VA?

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Pallanza View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Pallanza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 15:59
At first, it would be helpful to have a look into the manufacturer's description of the camera.

As to your questions:
- if the EVF is nice (I like the A37's EVF)
   yes, the EVF is fine, but if you do wear glasses, you should be a bit cautious not to press it in
- if the lens is nice (and would allow me do play with DOF? - I don't think so)
    The lens is very good, you can select aperture
- if the low light capabilites are OK (I can use A37 with 50/1.4 at F2 or Tam17-50 at 2,8; is it comparable?)
     I used the RX100iii up to ISO 6400 (raw). Under normal conditions (museum)no problem with low light.
- if there is MF with focus peaking and magnification (nice on A37)
     never used
- if zoom can be operated with a ring
      No. Have a look at the product description.
- if there is RAW capability
    Yes. Have a look at the product description.
 



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addy landzaat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote addy landzaat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 16:02
Reading the reviews on the RX100's with a viewfinder it seems these are basically screen cameras with the EVF as an option when needed.

The Panasonics are known for having poor EVF's. The EVF of my G1x3 is great.

The A37's viewfinder is 1.14m with 1.09 (0.73 35mm equiv.) magnification.
The RX100 iii has 1.14m with 0.59 magnification and the RX100 va has 2.36 with 0.59x magnification. So yes, these are smaller but the RX100 va has a higher resolution.

Find a shop to look at the EVF is probably wise.
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dCap View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 16:38
Yep, it is a small compact camera ... with a small EVF. Because: physics.

I wear glasses and the EVF (on the IV, and I think all of them) has a rubber square ring (non-detachable). Mine looks to have retained all the rubber after 18 months use. Daily for 6 months, in-hand in a coastal town.

The VI and VII has a one-move EVF pop-up and out. But that has a slower lens (24-200mm too). The III thru Va have a two-part-action to enable and then retract. In actual use it is fine. One-action would be nice, but most the time I leave mine retracted. You can turn the camera off and leave the EVF in the up and out position.

There is one camera with 1-type sensor that is physically smaller - the Canon G9X II this starts at 28mm f2 and goes to f-slow-something. Has no EVF. Has a fixed LCD. But has touch (nice) and the ring around the lens clicks (nice). It is very very small [I sold mind - too small]. I got it years ago to use especially as just a 28/2, but it was too fiddly and too small. Hence my hesitation at buying the RX100 new.

Build quality of the RX100 (IV) is excellent - almost everything is metal. Have a look on eBay (sold listings too) and you'll see some pretty beaten up versions as an idea of what they can take. They get used by 'phone-type-people' who drop things all the time.

Being that the RX100 brand is so well known and supported there are a bundle of third party add-on and things which I don't think the Canon/Panasonics have. I got mine after a decade of m43 and if I was a menu diver I would have favored the Panasonic but the size of the RX100 got me.

But my views are based on just 18 months of daily then regular use. There is a learning curve and some of the controls are a bit more fiddly than I'd like - it is a small camera ... and physics is a thing. I've adapted to point and press and the on/shoot time is pretty quick.

I have my lens ring set to jump from 24/28/35/50/70 (my choice/preference). But when I switch to MF the ring then only does MF and I need to use the rocker for zoom ... so, zoom/frame first, then switch to MF (controls are fiddly). I think the ring can be set to exp.comp, smooth zoom, jump zoom, and OFF. That said it isn't really designed to be a MF camera it is just a compact and that setting is there just in case. Most of the time it'll focus on what I want. But I use MF to force it to go out of focus to make pretty patterns (perhaps not the normal use case).

Despite Sony's un-challenged position as the world's worst menu designer ... I have the Fn button set to pull up the grid of 12 common things (and then never menu dive as I'd never find anything in there). 12 things are: fps - flash - AF - focus points - exp comp - ISO - ND - meter - WB - DR - face focus - mode. Most of the time I leave my settings in ... single - rear flash - AF - area - -0.3 exp - auto ISO - ND auto - AWB - DR off - face off. I use the rear dial to adjust aperture.

It will take some time to get to grips with the handling - which is why a camera store trial (and purchase) is a good idea. But if you can't then maybe someone local has one (any of the models?).

Buying used (eBay) is again a low risk thing. Plenty of mint models on eBay - use it for a month and if you don't like it you sell it for the same price (or keep it). I promised I'd get myself a new one ... but still haven't.

The newer ZV-1 is based on the RX100 (same lens as the III/IV/V/Va) but has a side flip LCD for the vlog crowd. No EVF though. Buttons are a bit chunky as it has a different market.
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dCap View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 16:53
Sorry that mine sounds like a sales pitch - I'm not on commission - but I get on real well with it. Considered getting a used VI as a 200mm lens (but then went out and about and realized I really didn't need a 200mm lens enough).

Instead of £800 on the GR III ... I got an iPhone SE 2 (my first ever iPhone and the smallest at the time) and the used RX100 IV ... for a total of £800. Very happy with my choice. If the GR IV gets a flipping LCD then I'll be very tempted.

The Ricoh GRIII is a much much much better camera - the controls are built for photographers (not computer gaming menu diving nerds). But the original (APS) and II had serious internal dust problems. And the LCD is fixed.

Ricoh/Pentax people don't use the internet so it is difficult to find out if the GR III has the same dust problems - it shouldn't since it has IBIS and a sensor shake at on/off.

When I switched from my Pan G80 (side LCD) + 12-35 to Fujifilm X-E3 with corner EVF, joy stick, but fixed LCD I didn't like it! I thought I'd miss IBIS/OIS but I missed the moveable LCD a lot lot more. So - then got the X-T3 with flip screen.

Gonna mention the Panasonic GX80 as it is pretty small and solid and cheaper than the RX100 Va. Comes with a little 12-32 lens. Bigger sensor too. if you like primes then the 14/2.5 is often over looked (and tiny). In the UK the GX80/kit is the same price as the RX100 III. And there is a silly small 35-100 (70-200) too. But the GX80 is really quite heavy in the hand (2x the weight of the RX?) - very solid build. And the EVF is not very nice. The EVF on the RX100 is considerably better.

Comparing the RX100 to a dSLR is strange - in use the dSLR is familar and the controls should be designed to be used a lot. Like my X-T3 - the knobs and dials are designed to be used. A compact is designed to be turned on - snap - turned off. I can turn my RX100 on and snap a shot quicker than with a phone. With a phone I can tap to focus. With the RX100 I rely on it focusing on the main thing - which it does well. I use both regularly.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote LAbernethy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 17:40
Originally posted by jenik.nk jenik.nk wrote:

Originally posted by Miranda F Miranda F wrote:

I was going to buy an RX100 until I tried one in a shop and thought it was a delicate over-priced toy with a tiny and barely usable EVF.

I don't like this point. I really like the EVF on my A37 and would like to have a nice EVF. Unfortunately I don't think I have a good chance to try it. Thank you for your observation.

Originally posted by Miranda F Miranda F wrote:

I know many here don't share that opinion but for my money Canon & Panasonic have always done pocket cameras better than Sony, with some models not much larger having metal cases, better build quality, or better EVF (not necessarily all at once ...).

Except for Panasonic TZ100, which cameras do you mean or would you suggest?

Thank you.

I will agree. I really liked the a37 as a camera and that EVF in particular. I just didn't like the battery.
You will hate the EVF on the RX100. You might learn to suffer it but if a VF is important to you I doubt you can love it. It really is a screen with an EVF option.
Out of the compacts, I like the Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX100 the best. Everything I like about the Sony a6XXX series is here but so is everything I hate about the a6XXX series too.
I should say for full disclosure that the pocket portable solution I settled on is an Olympus OM-D EM-5 Mk II with a Panasonic Lumix G 20mm F1.7 II for a better EVF experience.
I've tried the smaller EVF's and don't like them. I've tried the screen options like the Olympus Pen, and Tough and don't like them either.


Edited by LAbernethy - 29 December 2021 at 18:12
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jenik.nk View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote jenik.nk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 17:54
Wow, I am very grateful for your comments. Thank you for your time. I'll read that again carefully.

Furtunately, I don't wear glasses and my sight seems to be excellent.
α37 - Tamron 17-50 - Min 28-105, 35-105 (O), 35-70/4, Beercan, 135/2.8; Sony 50/1.4 - Σ EF-500 DG SUPER
 



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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 18:31
Originally posted by jenik.nk jenik.nk wrote:


I would like to know about the mark3:
1 - if the EVF is nice (I like the A37's EVF)
2 - if the lens is nice (and would allow me do play with DOF? - I don't think so)
3 - if the low light capabilites are OK (I can use A37 with 50/1.4 at F2 or Tam17-50 at 2,8; is it comparable?)
4 - if there is MF with focus peaking and magnification (nice on A37)
5 - if zoom can be operated with a ring
6 - if there is RAW capability

1 - It's as nice as a retractable EVF can be. The main drawback is that there's no eyecup, so I often need to shield it with my hand in bright conditions.
2 - Yes. Very nice. DOF 'playing' is understandably limited, but certainly possible.
3 - They're okay in my book. A 1" sensor at f/1.8-f/2.8 is satisfactory for anything I'm likely to shoot in low light.
4 - Yes.
5 - Yes.
6 - Yes.

... and generally, if it is worth buying in 2022 ...

Only you can answer what's worth buying to you. I bought mine years ago and have had no compelling reason to upgrade it, but that's me.

You should probably read this if you haven't already:

https://www.dpreview.com/articles/7237085229/which-sony-rx100-is-right-for-you
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 18:41
Originally posted by Pallanza Pallanza wrote:

- if zoom can be operated with a ring
      No. Have a look at the product description.

That's incorrect. The RX100M3 has an option under Custom Key Settings to zoom using the control ring (as long as manual focus is not being used).
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sybersitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 18:43
Oops ... double post.
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addy landzaat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote addy landzaat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 19:41
Originally posted by dCap dCap wrote:

Ricoh/Pentax people don't use the internet so it is difficult to find out if the GR III has the same dust problems - it shouldn't since it has IBIS and a sensor shake at on/off.
There is a Ricoh GR subforum on Pentax Forums
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 20:01
Originally posted by addy landzaat addy landzaat wrote:

Originally posted by dCap dCap wrote:

Ricoh/Pentax people don't use the internet so it is difficult to find out if the GR III has the same dust problems - it shouldn't since it has IBIS and a sensor shake at on/off.
There is a Ricoh GR subforum on Pentax Forums


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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 20:14
I am somewhat perplexed (as an RX100 owner) at the contrasting comments in this thread - sure some are from people who have only touched it (and mistakenly thought it was made from plastic) ... but as a reference point it is either unusable garbage or excellent!?

It is a compact camera not a 5x4" field plate camera. It is something that slips into actual trousers/pants pocket.

I've honestly seriously considered not having any other camera and just running my RX100 IV - now, it isn't 'that' good. It is a compact camera. And I have assumed that the OP (and anyone else reading) has held a compact camera before. And understands that to make something small it won't have the biggest EVF ever made or a medium format sensor. It is almost invisible on the street compared to the smartphone in everyone else's hand and just 300g.

Having owned (far far too) many cameras in the last 34 years I'm sure if any of my other tools broke or got lost I'd look around and think what to replace it with. With the RX100 - I'd just get another one asap.

I kinda want to see the pockets that people are slipping the a6000000000000 with super-duper zoom into ... and can y'all actually walk with this in your pocket?

Foxed I am.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dCap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 20:18
might be of interest
https://www.dyxum.com/dforum/choosing-an-rx100_topic138237_page1.html
[title = choosing an RX100 ... from June 2020]
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Miranda F View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Miranda F Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2021 at 21:39
Originally posted by dCap dCap wrote:

I am somewhat perplexed (as an RX100 owner) at the contrasting comments in this thread - sure some are from people who have only touched it (and mistakenly thought it was made from plastic) ... but as a reference point it is either unusable garbage or excellent!?

Fair comment. I was comparing the RX100 (ii or iii?) against two older canon compacts I bought cheap s/h (neither with an EVF) for build quality, and with the Nex-6 for EVF. To my taste it was inferior to all three in useability but I didn't buy it so I will gladly defer to those who did.
Plus I'm well over sixty and can't use an EVF without a decent dioptre adjustment; I hate using the LCD, don't wear glasses for distance vision and I'm not going to put a pair on to use a camera, so it's either use the EVF or nothing ... which is why I stopped using the Canon and went for the Nex-6.

My main gripe with Sony compacts *used* to be that they were between 5 and 10 years behind the competition in providing amateur/pro functionality, and for a long time sold the things for casual use by people who wouldn't know what a PASM dial was and didn't care they didn't have one. They've corrected that now, but there's still a lingering feeling that in compacts Sony care more about miniaturisation than usability. Again, they're improving, but there's a heck of a lot of competition in the pocket camera business despite the increasing capability of smartphones. And if I could afford the best-lensed smartphone I wouldn't need the Nex at all...

For me personally, virtually all my compact camera needs are met by the Nex-6 with one or other of the various pancake lenses that fit, and the smartphone I carry around in my pocket all day. Sometimes I take the Nex-6 for a daytrip to show it some proper lenses and it does that too. The EVF is not quite up to modern FE standards but it pretty good, and I like the artificial horizon which greatly reduces the number of images I take with wonky horizontals.
I guess the key is to find something you like and stick to it, unless you're the kind of person who likes to try everything.

Edited by Miranda F - 29 December 2021 at 21:46
Miranda F & Sensorex, Sony A7Rii, A58, Nex-6, Dynax 4, 5, 60, 500si/600si/700si/800si, various Sony & Minolta lenses, several Tamrons, lots of MF primes and *far* too many old film cameras ...
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