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Indoor Sports Photography

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romke View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote romke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Indoor Sports Photography
    Posted: 02 March 2013 at 19:53
Originally posted by Swede66 Swede66 wrote:

Ramblings you think, not really, my point with this introduction is, that having played a certain sport is a huge advantage and makes it easier to get the shots you want, that stands out from the others. To know where the action is gonna happen is critical to get the good shots. Trying to follow the game only will make you trigger the shutter a fraction to late and miss the key moments instead of anticipating situations and trusting your instincts.


I think this is by far the most important statement you make regarding (indoor) sportsphotography.

Equipment and technique of course have their role, but the rules are not that different from other forms of shooting. You need to be able to select a decent WB and to select a suitable combination of aperture and shutter speed so you can record a scene you want it to be recorded and poor lighting makes that more difficult. And of course fast lenses and a speedy AF help there. But in the past people did it manually - and quite well.

The most important factor is knowing the particular type of sport. It works two ways - you will most likely have a idea what you want to show and how (and what equipment you will need) and secondly you will be more or less be able to anticipate what will happen where and when. If you don't, most likely you will be too late - each and every time again....

In that respect i like what you say about high speed continuous shooting. I have the same experience. A few shots will do, there is no need for 6 or more. It is all about trying to fire at the precise moment. 10 shots before and 10 shots after do not help you there - if the "middle shot" is just a fraction too soon or too late you still end up with nothing.

As for the settings, mine are somewhat different.

Usually i set a custom WB. As long as the playing field is more or less evenly lit, you can get away with that and you avoid that the WB is influenced by the prominence of clothing in any particular color. That saves time in post processing.

Most times i use manual exposure settings where i choose aperture and shutter speed as required. I start out with some test shots (before the game but with the lighting already on) and then lock the exposure. After that i can change aperture or shutter speed while keeping the EV constant.

Focusing is either AF-C or manual with WA shots.

Because of the low light in the lower leagues i tend to use primes. I find the use of zooms both a boon and a handicap.

The good thing is you can change the framing "on the fly", the downside that you will be trying to record all things that happen all over the place - which imo is quite impossible.

Things get easier when you concentrate on a certain area and then after some time on another. If you are lucky, you end up with some quite good shots - if you are not, you end up with nothing because you happened to be at the wrong place, at the wrong time with unsuitable equipment....

May i ask for a second installment about soccer and tennis?



 



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revdocjim View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote revdocjim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 March 2013 at 17:08
I have used the A77 with the Min 85/1.4 (and various other lenses) extensively for indoor basketball and volleyball. My settings are as follows:

AF-C
Burst mode HI (not 12fps)
AWB
A-mode
F/2.2 or f2
ISO 2000
Center spot AF
Matrix metering
DRO - off
Steady Shot On
EVF/LCD switching - Manual and set to EVF
Auto review - Off

I have put all these settings in one of the memory settings (except the last two which need to be set manually). Depending on the gym lighting sometimes I have to adjust the ISO or aperture a bit.

The rest is basically up to my ability or lack of such. It has taken a while to improve my timing and probably the single biggest factor has been to learn to shoot with both eyes open.
Gallery A7S, A7Rii, Batis 18/2.8, 25/2 Sony 35/2.8, 55/1.8, 90/2.8M, 24-105/4, Minolta 135STF, 200/2.8 Blog
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Kilkry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 March 2013 at 13:41
In two weeks I will be photographing another roller derby event, with the difference that I will have free access to ground level, as long as I'm not in the way, as I will be one of two or more 'official' photographers.

Every professional photog I've seen there has used a Canon or Sigma 70-200, but I imagine they can rack up the ISO quite well; except once when I saw a shorter prime of some sort together with an external, onboard flash.

The last times I did this it was with the Mino 200 f/2,8 and the 35 f/1,8 SAM, all from a balcony, from which 200mm was a good focal length on a crop sensor. I'd sometimes get ~1/200 - 1/250 with ISO3200 and sometimes ISO1600, at f/2,8 and 200mm and I mostly panned to the rhythm of the derbiers.

I don't have the Mino anymore, nor the A580; instead I thought I'd try with a Sigma 85 f/1,4 and an a77.

From what I've seen, it will be too slow to AF on derbiers coming against me, although I think with AF-C and panning them from the side can work out OK. I have two queries, if they aren't outside the scope of this thread:

For derbiers coming against me:
A. Would setting the A77 to AE Speed 12fps mode and the lens to manual focus work, for prefocusing on a spot a couple of meters in front of me, then let loose the x fine jpegs as they near me? Would keeping the AF on and using one of the two continuous shooting modes work better?

I plan on using a NEX-3 in the same way; manual focus and AE Speed mode, either with the Sigma 19 f/2,8 (it's sharp), or the non-sharp but good-for-BW-portraits Industar 69 f/2,8 - the latter doesn't contribute to the battery drain and this battery drains quickly.

Reg. flash:
B. If I'm allowed flash, would it (the Sony 58) work if I stood it on the floor, to the left of me, and then tried to AF as they came towards me and shoot once with the popup flash to get the 58 to light them from the side, do you think? It would be uneven, but it might look cool, if the af had time to lock.

I have been tempted to acquire a Tokina 80-200 f/2,8, but by all accounts it won't AF terribly fast even on an A77 and might not be all that sharp wide open. And I will not go over IS1600 for any reason; will aim to keep it at 1250.

Any suggestions would be rather welcome. I have photos from the previous events on my flickur if that helps (Grynna).



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Shinebox View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Shinebox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 March 2013 at 02:52
I have seen a lot of reviews about focsing issues with this lens, guess i should have done some more research.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Shinebox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 March 2013 at 12:26
I did do some of that a few days ago and I thought i noticed some back focusing so i set -6 on AF adjustment and pics seemes sharper, then i took it outside and did some more test shots only to find that it seemed like it wasn't focusing properly on target with -6 set, set it back to 0 micro adjust and it looked good again. Think i am second guessing myself with this. IDK, i'll do some more testing.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote stiuskr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 March 2013 at 12:21
Shinebox, you should do some lens testing at all aperture settings. Set it up on a tripod and pick a target, and then with center spot focus with AF on just start working your way up from f2.8. Turn SS off and use a remote release or the 2 second delay and while you're at it you can also do the same but only change the ISO values. Then when you're done upload them to a seperate folder and then scroll through the images slideshow style.
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a99M2 a99 a77 a700 KM7D|Min24/2.8 Min35/2 So50/1.4 So50/2.8 Min85/1.4G Tam90/2.8 Tam180/3.5|Tam17-50 CZ24-70G2 KM28-75D So70-200G1 So70-300G So70-400G1| SonyF60 AD200R2
 



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Shinebox View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Shinebox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 March 2013 at 12:14
All my shots were at 2.8 at various focal lengths. I wanted to keep aperture wide open to keep ISO down, set to AUTO. SOme shots were better then others. I am not sure what it was maybe the lighing mixed in with a tad of sotness at 2.8. These pictures were nowhere near the shots above. I mean i would keep them but I wouldn't give them to anyone for use anywhere. I would think that shutter speed would be ok because at most times the derby players aren't moving anywhere near as fast as an ice hockey game. I also had my Canon 60D with a 2.0 35mm L lens and was not impressed wither with those pics. I'm just trying to figure out what i did so I can improve technique. Maybe next time i will try faster shutter and use f4.0.
I was also using the center point spot focus with some noise reduction applied. Also had a filter on it and maybe it had a hand in it also.
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Swede66 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Swede66 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 March 2013 at 09:07
@madtownkeith, how do you like your 70-200G?

@Shinebox, a couple of questions: the softness you get in the shots, do you think it's motionblur or are they just slightly off focus. I have never been to a roller derby so I really don't know much about it so I was thinking would it help to prefocus?

The second thing, maybe your lens is a bit soft at aperture 2.8, compare with your shots taken at the soccergames but compare only with those at F2.8.

I would imagine that you get shutterspeeds in around 1/250-1/350 @ 2.8 and ISO around 1000, which I think would be enough but have you tried with faster shutterspeeds?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Shinebox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 February 2013 at 13:54
Those shots are nice a crisp. I just posted a question asking for some help on this type of sports shooting. I seemed to have gotten some slightly soft shots while at an indoor roller derby event. I was using the Tamron 70-200 f2.8 with aperture at 2.8 ISO anywhere around 800-1250 depending on shots and zoom range. Single point auto focus continuous mode. All pics were a bit soft and not sharp. I mean they weren't bad but i would not certainly be happy if i was gettting paid.
Not sure if it was the lens or what. I have gotten great results at outdoor soccer games with this camera lens combo (A77 and Tammy).
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Post Options Post Options   Quote madtownkeith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2012 at 21:22
Thanks Magnus. I've tried the zone focusing a bit too, but haven't decided if I like it better than center point AF.

I did finally bite the bullet on the Sony 70-200 2.8 today, so interested to see how much better it does than my current Sigma 70-200 2.8 HSM. Hopefully, the focus limiter will really help with continuous AF.
a77, Sigma 18-250, Sony 35 1.8, Sigma 70-200 HSM II, Rokinon 85 1.4, and other gear constantly on rotation :)
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Swede66 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2012 at 18:12
@Jetsplace. You're right, the light changes not very much through the areas I cover with my 70-200 in the arena. If I want to shoot something off the ice I just change to aperture priority. During summer I also shoot some soccer and I use aperture priority most of the times.

@madtownkeith, I'm still experimenting a little about what autofocus to use. So far, center focus point works best but to get closer without cropping to much I would like to learn to use the zone AF function better. It's very easy to use the centerpoint AF though, then crop the uninteresting parts made possible by the high resolution results the a77 produce.

I use the shutter and the continous AF works really well so I rarely use single shot AF during a game.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote madtownkeith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2012 at 15:00
Great hockey shots. Wish I had that kind of light for my kids' indoor sports, but I know I wouldn't take advantage of it the way you do.

A couple questions for you about settings on the a77, and your focus point. What focus point/mode are you using? Do you stick with the center AF point, or do you pick one that would be closer to the faces in your compositions? I've always struggled with this - the camera seems to do best in terms of tracking the action using the center AF spot, but then you end up with faces that are slightly out of focus.

Also, how are you activating auto focus? Do you use the AF button on the back, or do you just go with the shutter.

And any further thoughts on single shot AF vs continuous?

Thanks again!
a77, Sigma 18-250, Sony 35 1.8, Sigma 70-200 HSM II, Rokinon 85 1.4, and other gear constantly on rotation :)
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Post Options Post Options   Quote @Jetsplace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 January 2012 at 02:13
Great article Impressive shots with those shutterspeeds.

Just a question.. Why shoot on manual and not shutterspeed preference?
As I shoot soccergames of my sons my preference settings are auto WB but also auto Iso but with the shutter fixed on 1/500 or something around that.
Or probably it is a silly question because most likely I already know the answer... in the icehall the light probably remains the same while outside with the soccer it is constantly changing. On manual I had or overexposed or underexposed pictures with sun on and off and I was constantly switching settings but on S - with auto iso it was more or less balanced.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Swede66 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2012 at 11:02
@Jim, Do you use any noise removal software. I think your shots looks so "clean" for have been shot @ ISO250?



I would like to add some shots that didn't fit in the original article.

First 2 shots from a dimly lit hall. Some friends and me plays some floorball every monday night and one night I brought my camera.

1. ISO 1600 - f2.8 and 1/250

DSC00157 by Swede66, on Flickr

2. ISO 1600 - f2.8 and 1/200

DSC00259 by Swede66, on Flickr

3. Some more motion blur from a bandygame

IFK Rättvik vs Örebro by Swede66, on Flickr

4. another static moment

#34 Hanses by Swede66, on Flickr
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